Children Are More ValuableThan Women Are More Valuable Than Men, Says UN

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/563D1044-AB85-4A30-82B4-77A00ADBB316.htm

“Lebanese Prime Minister Fouad Siniora said more than 500,000 people had been displaced and appealed for international help.

"I call on you to respond immediately and without reservation to our call for a ceasefire and to provide urgent international *humanitarian* aid," he said in a televised address.”

“The United Nations Children's Fund has appealed for $7.3 million to meet the immediate needs of women and children.”

Are men human?

Are men human?

Article 25.

(2) Motherhood and childhood are entitled to special care and assistance. All children, whether born in or out of wedlock, shall enjoy the same social protection.

No.

--Demonspawn

Are men human?

Clearly we are not (in the eyes of women, governments, the children we pay for but never see, the healthcare system, the law, etc.), but that's no surprise to the men hereabouts.

(When I submitted this story, I guess I wasn't logged in, so it shows as coming from an anonymous user. Ooops.)

Lets ask them.

http://www.un.org/forms/feedback/english.asp

OR

inquiries@un.org

They ignore half of humanity because men are slaves, almost universally, and being disposable property, slaves have never mattered for much. I'm sorry to keep repeating this, but it's the only reasonable explanation for the global climate of misandry, the ongoing criminalization of all things male and masculine, the exclusion of men from education and pensioned public service jobs, the massive over-representation of men in prison populations (minority men in particular), the fact that only men can be used for forced labour, the fact that men are invariably the ones drafted and sent off to die in wars, the fact that men are 90+% of workplace fatalities, the fact that our life expectancy is lower (and this is universally celebrated as some sort of "victory") and the constant, generally successful attempts to evict us from our families while making us pay and pay and pay.

Writing to the slave owners to complain about being a slave is a bit silly, wouldn't you say? Hardly worth the lost skin cells on the keyboard. How about we just refuse en masse to do the world's dirty work and to be everyone's whipping boys? If there's one thing slave owners know, it's that you can't kill all the slaves, or you end up doing all the work yourselves.

Until we get ourselves organized enough to call for general strikes and such (i.e. a "man-out"), including non-payment of any sort of support under euphamistically named "family" laws so that these women who claim so loudly to be our equals can prove it for a change, a refusal to provide even essential services and so on, it's going to be a long, long road. As a lifelong student of history, I've observed that slavery inevitably continues until emancipation is achieved through warfare or rebellion. Aside from the fact that I never advocate violence against anyone, warfare isn't an option in the physical sense (there's no one target to fight), and any slave rebellion/revolt will have to be calculated to peacefully and non-violently cause extreme stress while only causing very slight, very specific damage to social structures, laws, etc. After all, among the "enemy" here are our mothers, sisters, daughters and in some cases, wives, i.e. the women we love and care about. It's a truly unique situation, partially because of the fact that most men aren't aware of their condition of servitude, and partially because even if they were, they might still accept it as part of the price of being a man. Unfortunately, the feminists know this, and use our protective nature against us.

This is why men's consciousness and activism are such important first steps: if we get the word out to average men that they are slaves in this society, and get them to understand that they deserve better in their own lives, if it becomes necessary we can then start moving towards things like civil disobedience, other non-violent but disruptive protests, strikes and so forth. That's assuming we don't achieve meaningful change through our more subtle efforts first, of course. I hope that such extreme measures can be avoided, but I'm certainly prepared to consider those options in the future if things don't improve. It's this former slave's opinion that doing nothing is not an option.

http://www.hottopictalk.com/talk/viewtopic.php?p=1217#1217

Random man I hear you, I agree partly but I don’t think taking a militant stance will spread awareness or help to gain support to the point that we would have the clout to “strike”. I think talk of war and rebellion will turn off the public at large both men and women and forever keep the men’s movement on the fringe of activist and lobby groups.

Diplomacy before violence is the only way, if we do not even attempt to go thru proper channels and seek change thru political dialogue and we just start by being violent and militant we will only be ignored or quashed outright.

I talked with the woman at the UN, I asked her if it was the UN’s opinion that men are not human, I asked why a humanitarian org would take a feminist stance on violence and war, and why they would ignore half of humanity in their war relief, I refered her to this thread. She took me very seriously stated that they were very valid questions, and good questions, as if she had never looked at it that way before.

I believe our cultures misandry exists and festers because most people just take it for granted or are brainwashed by feminisms false perceptions of gender status and often they only need to be made aware of it, to have it pointed out to them using in an undeniable example like this, then they begin to see it everywhere, think about where it started for you, what was the thing, event/thought/ realization that really opened your eyes?

I believe this works for other people as well. We are angry and we are pissed off and rightfully so, but to the public at large, due to ignorance false perceptions men’s equality is seen as a contradiction in terms, but in reality the movement is VERY VALID and the issues very real, getting the truth out and spreading awareness should be the first thing, when we have numbers we will have clout.

If we are standing strong and united and they still ignore us and enslave us then we fight as a last resort.

till that point in time the work will be kinda “pussy” and grass roots it ain’t fun but it needs to be done.

I'm not advocating being what I'd consider militant or violent, hujo. If you read my comment, I'm actually advocating the exact opposite of such behaviour (see the boldface portion). I'm always against violence, although some civil disobedience will soon become necessary, as it has been for every civil rights cause. I agree fully: taking such action at this stage would be counter-productive and we'd be dismissed as crazies at this point. I mean, imagine the "lunacy" of mere men demanding to be treated like human beings! Don't we realize that we're always privileged oppressors?

Like you, I suggest that we work to raise awareness through activism. Yes, people will sometimes "open their eyes", but most people have them deliberately glued shut when it comes to seeing men as human beings. Once the public is aware of our cause, some very visible action will be necessary to change things, just as it was during the civil rights movement, just as it was for Indians seeking to expel the British. Activism is the key, I agree, but we will have to follow the examples of our predecessors at some point if meaningful change does not happen organically (very unlikely, in my opinion).

As for civil disobedience (which you might call "militant"), I think we disagree on why it is necessary. As long as the world and the women in it are getting what they want from men, nothing will ever change. Why would it? Our only leverage is to deny the world what it demands from us: our servitude, our children, our health, our liberty and our lives. Since denial of the things society wants to take from us is our only leverage, I don't see how we have any other way to cause change to occur in our own lifetimes.

hujo, I read your comments on the other board, and had a look at a couple of other threads. Please point out to your opponent in the "Legalizing Misandry" and toplessness discussion that women are allowed to go topless in many parts of the world, including Ontario (Canada). I can't stand whining, permanent victims, nor do I understand why they find it necessary to pollute otherwise intelligent discussions with their hypochondria.

I guess I did miss read you, sorry, and I mean, in retrospect there are areas in the men’s right struggle that deserve civil disobedience right now, namely the struggle to change family court, as the proper channels have been exhausted and it is all too clear that the system simply does not wish to lose there cash cow; the common man. So yeah time to for civil disobedience in this area. The Neighborhood protests in NZ are something we should start in NA.

Its just some comments on men’s sites worry me, I understand the anger and the feelings of helplessness but we must not become like feminists we must not let the frustration consume us and we must not become an anti-women movement immersed in our victimization or we will be no better than them.

I really feel the truth is powerful enough, unlike modern feminists we don’t have to make up issues, exaggerate issues, we have very real ones the focus should be getting those known to the general public and in an effective manner that will reach a large audience. Our biggest obstacle now is perception of gender status, most people buy into “Man always privileged women always oppressed” BS, but as we see with the UN and AI women are truly privileged in that they receive support and study while men are unstudied and ignored, no wonder we as a whole have a false consciousness regarding gender and violence we do not even consider men in violence research, it’s a joke, that not to many people are aware of.

(yes my detractor on that site will argue some weird points but she is not completely close minded, I link my threads to feminist sites so I often only get feminists arguing me if anyone argues at all , like I said though I do not feel the need to ban or censor them because the truth is more powerful than their fiction.)

Hujo, it sounds like we're of the same opinion here. I've always maintained (despite my periodic rants and occasional venting) that unlike feminism, this movement is about social justice and equality for all human beings, regardless of sex, race, etc. I won't suffer feminists of any kind because even the classical (i.e. non-radical) feminists are interested in seeking status and equality for women only. By definition, one cannot seek equality without a group to be equal to, and feminism actively seeks to destroy both men and masculinity, which makes it clear that their philosophy is representative of a hate movement, and has no interest in actual equality. If it did, the definition would indicate that they were seeking equality with men, not at the expense of men. Who the feminists believe they deserve to be "equal" to is beyond me, but it certainly isn't men.

Unlike feminists, who seek to marginalize and criminalize men, I'm not seeking to take anything from women, nor do I seek better standing in society for men as compared to women. I'm simply seeking equality and justice for men that is equal to the justice, rights and responsibilities our society accords women. If women were actually oppressed/enslaved in the mainstream of our society, I'd be fighting just as hard for their cause. In the meantime, their fictitious fantasy universe of "men are bad and women are good" does make for some interesting reading.

Some of the misogynistic crap out there scares me, too, just as much as the misandric crap that we get from every angle, every minute of every day scares me.