A long overdue essay: Honey, you're not a victim

hello

the essay was good. one thing bothered me a bit. her comment: "the age when young women in fatigues are dying in iraq"...any death during a war is tragic (male or female) but lets be honest, how many female soldiers have been killed in iraq? i would venture to say 99% of deaths are men. i understand the war was not the subject of her article, but i'm a bit tired of "the men and woman who have died defending their country"...i'll say it again: no one (male or female should die) but that phrase should be changed to "the 99% of men and the 1% of women who have died defending their nation"

thankyou

anthony

Indeed, I agree that these types of sentiments are long over due.

But I do not agree that the author tries to assign equal blame to both parties but at the same time claims only the man involved is deserving of punishment for his misdeeds.

Could she not just as easily be considered a homewrecker who seduced a married man as could a lecherious pervert?

No one knows who seduced who in the situation, but the author automatically assumes that the powerfull member of the evil patriarchy did in fact seduce the young woman.

Though many young women do smell money and then go to great lengths to attain it from a powerfull man.

I do not know, and neither does the author which way this situation came about, but it should not be assumed that it was all his fault and the only reason that the poor girl is not a victum in the authors eyes is that she is greatly profiting from it all.

the only reason the author senies victum status to this young female is that she is making boatloads of money. she still blames the man.

Progress? Yes
There yet? Not even close

Bert. We need to talk. Take it from an old guy: it's time to settle down a bit.

Flame wars don't do anybody any good in any forum. Whether people agree with you or not is irrelevant. When you have an on-topic point to make, people will ignore it if you persist in your attacks on other members of this community. It's antisocial and counterproductive to the cause. As for some of your comments about "kicking ass", metaphorically it might be a good idea in the short term, but I reject misogyny for the same reasons I reject misandry: because I believe that hate is what got us into this mess. The way out is the rejection of hate. But that's my opinion only.

Like you, I don't especially care what those who hate us and "sell us out" might think of us if they were to read these comments, given the unadulterated hate that spews constantly from the feminist camp and the media, but Ragtime and some of the other people you've gone after are not politicians who are voting for VAWA or to create a Ministry of Women's Superiority. They're not editors and publishers who gladly print misandry; God knows there are enough of those. They're fellow MRA's, man! Our allies, and you're alienating them. They're on our team, not with the feminists. They aren't selling men out for votes or money. The fact that they might take a different approach to the same problem doesn't make them any less beneficial to our overall struggle for justice, Bert. If you disagree with someone here, make an honest effort at a convincing argument for your point of view, and see if you can get them to agree. Sometimes you can, sometimes you can't.

I realize "netiquette" is not as well understood as most rules of order, but it does exist, and it would be very helpful for all involved if everyone would adhere to it in much the same way society asks people to refrain from hate speech and threats and other illegal activities. We comply with that restriction, because it's in our interests and the interests of society to do so. I know you're not a feminist troll, so I'm not ignoring you. That, too, is a part of "netiquette". Sadly, I will have to start doing so if you persist in using this forum for personal attacks.

Granted, some personal attacks have also been directed at you, but I'm sure you would grudgingly acknowledge that you are more often than not responsible for "starting" such exchanges. Please do try to keep personal insults (which are at best unproductive ad hominem attacks and at worst obscene) to a minimum, and keep the language civil. True enough, I'm known to rant once in a while, but it's always about the issue at hand, not the other members of this community.

As I said in a previous post, I'm not telling you not to be angry or hateful: that's your perogative. I think it's harming you more than you know, but that's my own opinion, to which I am entitled, and which you are free to reject. Believe me, I understand where the anger comes from.

As a fellow MRA and member of this little online community, I am asking politely that you observe the spoken and unspoken "rules" we all live by, on behalf of the others here, and our generous host. Above all, I ask that you respect the other people who post here. Many of us are tired and angry. We're all frustrated, and we're all bearing the yoke of feminism. We're all trying to figure out how best to deal with the misandry in society. There's no reason to be attacking other MRAs, and hate never solved a problem.

Somehow I managed to make my comments to Bert appear as the start of a subthread. My mistake - this should be appended to Bert's comment below.

It's refreshing to see someone even suggesting that women might possibly want to take responsibility for their actions, but there's rather a long way to go before that happens. Women walk out of murder trials unscathed, thanks to the preference given to their sex, and there aren't many women walking the Earth who haven't had 20+ years of conditioning with the "it's all men's fault, you're a victim, you're special and you're always better and more valuable than men" bullshit. It's going to take a long, long time before we change the system that has convinced girls and women that being a filthy whore is "empowering", that being a mindless leech is "power" and that they are "entitled" because they are "victims".

I too am getting frustrated about the slutty behavior of women and girls of that article, but I'm now starting to realize that being hateful towards them for their past wrongdoing is only going to drag us down towards the grave! Believe me, I've tried this before when I was so adamantly pissed at Burk for the Augusta fiasco that i wanted to murderously shut her up...but that wasn't happening and wouldn't do much good! I understand what everyone in this room is going through, being frustrated, getting screwed, and being malevolently forced fed by a corrupt, selfish country that doesn't practice pure rights, freedom, and responsibility, but instead blind exploitation, greed, and hypocrisy...let's face it, down the line I don't condone misogyny or misandry, but if these women continue with their unscrupulous if-you-got-it-flaunt-it behavior, they're going to suffer big time and either end up all alone, killed, hurt, or even in jail; and the same goes for us if we continue our hatred in this movement!

Eman
Emma.noelle.blay@hotmail.com

*****masculism is a black male's best friend!!!!!*****

Emma,

This is a discussion group of frustrated individuals who have the freedom to express themselves as they wish -- just as you do. Please don't tell us how to conduct ourselves. There is no hatred here -- just response to what we see and hear in a world that wants we MALES annhilated. If you cannot understand that, perhaps this is not the movement you thought it was.

With sincerity and respect,

Evil White Male Oppressor
"I am Not a Number I am a Free Man"

Excuse me Evil White Male? I'm not trying to tell anyone in this room what to do, I've been behind the scenes knowing what has been going on and I've even posted on certain subjects...and you have the nerve to talk that way to me???? Listen here, I'm not going to take sides on this matter or have a bone to pick with you, but what I meant was if we keep playa-hatin' in this movement, then it will die faster than you can say--'killa'! I've been a member on this board for 6 years and have been interested in mens issues by providing the black male voice! I didn't come in here to cause trouble or troll on anyone! Granted I may have said some hateful things...but I wouldn't ever cross the line doing so! [And secondly, this is the same person, except I have changed my user name for identity theft protection, so don't fret, I'm still here!] As for what I'm saying previously, the next time I hear anyone tell me to go away, I will never post on this forum again!

Eman
Emma.noelle.blay@hotmail.com

*****masculism is a black male's best friend!!!!!*****

Eman,

Read what I wrote -- Aren't we all about expressing ourselves freely? Or is it based on your standards alone? The movemnet will not die, it will keep expanding and become more important, but not if we alienate one another. As for your threat to never post again, that is your business not mine.

Evil White Male Oppressor
"I am Not a Number I am a Free Man"

EWM -- "This is a discussion group of frustrated individuals.."

That's the funniest thing anybody has ever posted here!

And the most tragically trivial.

Can you spell C-L-U-E-L-E-S-S?

Do you do stand-up in a club in Gary, Indiana?

I think I saw your routine once at a Holiday Inn lounge.

Funny guy!

EWM --

Well, I should have stayed for your punchlines.

Obviously you make some excellent points.

I just demonstrated the well-known ADHD potential of too many MRA-blog posters.

Must be a testosterone thang.

EWM, you reason and write well.

No more than that can be asked.

(BTW ... elevated testosterone is about to become banned by the Tour de France ... because an unknown American just won the Tour. Apparently it's all about whether the French can reclaim their dominance as "average semen dispensers.")

Feminists have speculated that male hormones inhibit "emotional intelligence."

Personally, I think they have anger-management issues.

How's that for an indirect apology?

In my spare time, I write Hillary Clinton's e-mail! ;-)

OK MRA's let's ban Roy for being an immature jerk who personally attacks other members on the board? No? Thought not. Roy, you are the classic example of what this feminzed society has done to men. You personally attack somebody you don't know, you shoot from the hip with your feelings, and you deny anyone else's opinion but your own. That about cover it, Roy...?

Evil White Male Oppressor
"I am Not a Number I am a Free Man"