Syndicate
Special Thanks To...
The following organizations were early supporters of Mensactivism.org, and we thank them for their support. If you'd like to trade links with us, see our Mensactivism.org supporters page.
iFeminists: Men are now being physically tortured, so they will "admit" to committing DV
Submitted by axolotl on Tue, 2007-05-01 06:24
Yes, that is happening in this here America.
The article addresses general DV issues and the VAWA, then gets more specific (read: graphic..this is not for the faint of heart):
"Torture victims have described events during their imprisonment where they were stripped naked and doused with cold water, and then "stun-gun/tasers" were applied to their testicles by law enforcement agents. This was repeated until they confessed/agreed to the fraudulent complaint filed against them."
"Over 800 cases of the prior listed types of torture have been reported to the victim's representatives in the United States Congress"
- Log in to post comments
Comments
MAJOR ACTIVISM NEEDED HERE
Clearly this is not a post-and-go story. I want to encourage everyone involved in MRA issues to get involved with making this story as MSM-public as possible. Write letters, start making inquiries. There is nothing trivial about this story.
Similar info in Equal Justice Foundation Newsletter
EJF Newsletter - June 2006
"In the worst cases the defendant — alleged abuser — was imprisoned without charges being filed, held without bail, sleep deprived, not fed, kept in cold rooms with little clothing, not allowed to lie down, kept shackled, and denied access to legal counsel"
(To get to this part of the letter, I scrolled just past the first screen) However it is good to read the whole article, since it discusses overall injustices in DV cases, against both acutal victims of DV, and the falsely accused.
-ax
Cites Please
I have no doubt that the "system" is corrupt to the very core and has no qualms about using torture on men arrested for DV.
However, there needs to be more verifiable source cites to bolster the case of torture and human rights abuses carried out by the state to illicit confessions.
Many of the crimes that were perpetrated at the Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq were carried out by Reservists who in their civilian lives were prison and jail guards. I have no doubt that torture does take place in the US prison system, I just need more cites.
This needs some serious background checks
Quite a claim she makes there without citing sources. We can't just believe this and write to people etc. about it, impossible.
p.s. ok, the TEN site at the above link talks about 27 verified cases. Now if this is indeed true, why are no criminal charges filed, were human rights groups contacted, why only that letter, etc etc.. hard to see through all this.
Could The Reason Be........................?
p.s. ok, the TEN site at the above link talks about 27 verified cases. Now if this is indeed true, why are no criminal charges filed, were human rights groups contacted, why only that letter, etc etc.. hard to see through all this.
......the alleged victims were men accused of DV?
Rest assured that any man who is arrested for DV is not in for a picnic. The "fuzz" will make it known in no uncertain terms that incarceration is not a stay at a five star hotel. And prosecutors thrive on convictions. And the easiest way to get a conviction is to get the accused to plea bargain. If every man who got arrested for DV demanded a jury trial the entire system would collapse. So, using intimidation through physical and mental torture to get a confession is most expedient. Besides, men as we all know are trained from childhood on to not complain and to trivialize abuse perpetrated on them. They are programmed to "man up" and not complain. Of course this means very few men will complain about their abuse while in jail. They are the perfect target.
Ok, I have it..all that can be done is already being done..
Oh well, I guess ma.org is not in the loop.
Below is an excerpt from T. Tersak's February commentary in "The Conservative Voice":
"Over the past two years, True Equality Network in concert with other notable organizations and writers, have exposed the failures and abuses of our domestic violence systems to the victims they profess to serve. We have also tried to reveal the abuses of the system and acts of violence and physical torture that they have inflicted on innocent victims of false allegations of abuse.
"What are the results of our efforts? Nearly a year after filing a complaint against Legal Services Corporation (LSC) for ignoring complaints by victims of abuses of the abuse systems, currently co-signed by over one hundred concerned organizations, attorneys, members of the media, and thousands of its victims, not one co-signer or victim has been contacted.Following the LSC complaint was a broad disclosure and notices to members of Congress detailing the use of physical torture in our own jails to coerce agreements from victims of false allegations of domestic abuses. The methods of torture discovered include, but are not limited to, hypothermic shock and genital electrocution."
---END OF EXCERPT---
The only thing I'm wondering now is, why hasn't this been reported in the mainstream media? After all, those hounds were more than ready to pounce at the slightest hint of torture at Abu Grahb (or whatever it's called).
-ax
Interesting, but..
..still, TEN's work and the whole issue needs to be documented better. There's also often this conservative "OMG they're destroying the traditional family" thing lurking behind these articles, something that makes such sources hard to use if you want to keep this typical American Reps vs. stuff out of the discussion.
When people like Biden push I-VAWA, we have to inform people in other countries about what's at stake. But that is hard to do here in Europe if the sources look like conservative propaganda with a fat american flag in the page header. And most of these "concerned organizations" seem to be from the MRA & father's rights scene.
Still, if there were more hard facts like descriptions of actual cases, we'd have something to work with.
Not sure what you're looking for..
Are you wanting to get more info, so us particular MRA's can do something with it? The way I figure it, all the orgs at the below link, have case specifics, otherwise they wouldn't be writing Congress. I doubt that they'd release much details to us if cases are "under investigation" or whatever. Also it appears that at least some in the media know of the issue, the column did mention "members of the media". I think if those people don't want to start spreading it to the general public yet, or if they have tried in vain for two years; or if for some legal reason they cannot do so right now, there is not much our particular organization can do.
Does that address what you are asking?
I think I see what you mean about the "destroying the family" thing. I have been thinking about this whole issue quite a while so will discuss it here (separately from my own political views):
It does appear that certain conservatives, right-wingers or whatever (not necessarily Tersak), try to spin the whole "problem with feminism" issue as if it is purely a creation of "liberal thinking", the implication being a creation of those on the left. Some even go further and say that the whole thing is symptomatic of some deep-seated problem with liberals, Democrats, lefties or whoever depending on who is the person putting on the spin. Or that it is indicative of some systemic problem due to liberals, or within the left itself. Case in point: the recent post about John Stossel (he is a conservative in case anyone doesn't know). Accordingly some of them focus on the traditional moral issues, such as how feminism is destroying the family. Feminism is an attack on morality, but what is more important is that it is a destabilizing, anarchist, separatist force which threatens to undermine basic freedoms of those living in the Western world.
Certainly it is true that historically, feminists have found more sympathy on the left.
Look, maybe it could be said that leftist politics contributed to providing an incubator for traditional feminist ideas (the ones about true equality), but it is 40 years later now and feminism has acquired enough momentum to be self-sustaining, so that it cannot any longer be viewed as some "branch" of the left or of liberalism. It is it's own entity and must be stopped. There is no point in hating liberals for being liberals if they are supporting feminists. The important thing is to hate ideological feminists:)
I try to seek out commentary on the problem from all sides, but the only "side" I am interested in is, "is this person contributing to ideological feminism, or are they trying to help fix things by being against it?" That is why you might notice, I posted something from ifeminists and a couple months ago posted something from Carey Roberts.
-ax
Welcome to Soviet Justice in the USA...
The USSR had a long tradition of using torture - psychological, emotional, physical - to coerce false confessions. Those who passed through the Soviet system's Gulags (roughly analgous to America's Friendly Gulags/Jails in many cases) were systematically denied any form of "justice".
The guards, the interrogators, the police forces were helpless to go along; they passively followed orders from the higher-up social planners. Which is why I see the corruption of torturing of male prisoners, many of whom falsely accused, going much further up the chain of command than you might think.
"the TEN site at the above link talks about 27 verified cases. Now if this is indeed true, why are no criminal charges filed, were human rights groups contacted, why only that letter, etc etc.. hard to see through all this."
America's judicial system is designed to remove a man's dignity, to remove his wealth, his independence and to plunge him into a No Man's Land of Communistic, 1984 justice. By the time his wife/false accuser has raped him in Court - which is fully sanctioned, indeed, encouraged by the State - the man is emotionally and financially exhausted.
The legal leeches (Judges, lawyers, psychologists, social workers, etc.) know that the money is made in taking on women's cases. The media, as you can see, has put up a Lace Curtain, where it ignores issues of important to men, except of course, when it might involve tainting the reputations of wealthy University students, a la the Duke "rape" trial. It reported the outcome of said case purely as a matter of course, and needless to say, the mechanisms of how such a false accusation could progress so far in the legal system was given little to no coverage by the mainstream media.
As RADAR said, the only unusual thing about the Duke case is that the prosecutor got caught:
"The only thing unusual about this case is that the innocent victims of false accusation had the resources to defend themselves against the overwhelming power of the state."
The State has long given up on trying to defend men in society, and indeed works at all levels to reduce and degrade men's role.
So that man does not have a lot of friends, now does he? Whether is innocent, guilty or simply someone who "got divorced" he will be subjected to the basest of treatment by all of the systems that should support him.
He does not have the energy, and he certainly does not have the money. As highlighted above you need resources if you want to take on the media or the State. A lot of resources. The average guy does not have that.
It is shocking for me to learn that this is a common occurence in our justice system, and yet, it fits in perfectly with the "guilty-until-proven-innocent", "pro-arrest" lines of text found in legislation. The men of America are living in 1984, and pass through a legal process right on par with that of the Soviets....
Let's hope the System breaks down of itself some day soon, lest we are stuck in decade after decade of State-controlled repression...
I pretty much agree
Even just a half-year ago, I would have called that alarmist talk, but now I don't think that is going too far (ok, maybe a slight bit. After all, there is the "freedom project" or whatever it's called, that has gotten 200 guys freed, on DNA evidence I think, Also they let the media in the prisons ala "Lock-Up"). But if people do not take Orwell to be describing an exact scenario, but instead using some metaphorical constructs, we are just about at 1984 now. Of course feminism isn't the only thing causing this situation.
-ax
Well..
..the political and judical System in the US is quite different from the European countries. For example, the Liberal party is traditionally a coalition partner of the Conservatives here and not on the left of the spectrum at all.
American Conservatives have an extremely bad reputation here these days and if I cannot explain their suspicious involvement in "anti-feminism", I don't even need to start translating US articles. To do that, I first have to be sure about the background myself.
And what I was also looking for in this case..names, descriptions, something more definitive. I can still get that from the people involved when I contact them I guess.
About your last paragraph; it's important why someone opposes feminism. If it's for the wrong reasons (for example if the person is a religious fanatic), there is a problem.
Let's not forget that most of our views here are quite progressive. My ancestors a hundred years ago may have had social privileges compared to their wives, but they also were under the full effect of the cliches of society. For example through 3 years (!) compulsory military service or dangerous jobs.
Too little has changed since then for men. The cliches need to go away, and people who are anti-feminist for the wrong reasons will not help with that in the end. I don't refer to conservative people in general, but to a certain part with reactionary tendencies.
I guess I'm "middle of the road"
Of course it matters why someome's against ideological feminism. That doesn't mean, however, that some other person's reasons are wrong. That would itself be a moral judgement.
Moral values are under attack by feminists, and this attack cannot be ignored. Radical feminists are trying to destroy the family. The nuclear family is perhaps THE stabilizing influence on society (not that there's anything wrong with being single or gay). I do see however, where those in other countries would be suspicious of what appears to them to simply be flag-waving, bible-thumping conservatives (I'm not referring to you in particular). It is sad, however, if they necessarily associate all those seeking to, for example, avert the breakup of the family structure, with "extreme" conservativism. Perhaps that cannot be avoided.
If I can I'll try to get more specifics on the torture cases. Maybe I can even contact Tersak herself, if I can find her email address. Don't hold me to anything though. Maybe we can start a collection pot on this site, to hire an "investigator" of some sort ;-)
-ax
Atrocious. This information must be spread and action taken.
If this is true, this has to be one of the most atrocious events I've learned of in a long time. As it is of the highest importance, I'm showing everyone I know this article, and telling them to pass it on. I'm going to post several copies of it around the university campuses where I live, and leave it in some professors' mailboxes (particulary feminist ones, if that does any good). Who knows, it might have at least some impact (and I do almost shake when I write that because something like this should make a tremendous impact, but after reading about the stolid, indifferent non-responses from the members of congress...how disgusting!). Yes it would help immensely if the author gave good references, but I'll be doing my own research on this abhorrence anyway.
Hello out there..
Is anyone but me still following this thread?? I emailed RADAR asking about details, and they forwarded to the True Equality Network. That was a couple days ago, still haven't heard anything.
-ax