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by LSBeene on 10:15 AM February 5th, 2006 EST (#1)
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Joe McCarthy wasn't some power consumed demagogue (?sp). As it turned out upon the release of the Venona Papers in 1995 (essentially we were 'tapping' the Soviets' encrypted transmits) the people he named WERE communist spies.
Some of them were running or influencing the State Department, were in the code rooms of the Pentagon, and reporting our military secrets to the Soviets.
Turns out McCarthy was right. But the "revision" (read: leftist smear and rewriting) of history doesn't tell that side of the story.
Besides that, I LOVED this guy's activism.
Steven
"Watch our backs at home, we'll guard the wall over here. Sleep safe tonight, we're on the job."
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by RandomMan on 01:11 PM February 5th, 2006 EST (#5)
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You can't be serious. He decimated hundreds of innocent peoples' lives and careers with his witchhunting. Sure there were spies, and he may even have caught a few. But most of the people that were "implicated" were innocent, but suffered nonetheless. The folks in the movie business that were sucked in to his little cultural revolution, most of them Jewish, most of them innocent: do you think that was OK too?
Why do you believe that the tactics he used were OK? Why was it OK for so many people who weren't spies to be destroyed? Because you weren't one of them, perhaps?
Enough with the far-right rhetoric, guys. This movement needs to transcend right-wing, neoconservative, Christian politics if its going to survive. I'm no fan of the political right OR left, yet I'm an outspoken men's activist. Do you really want to alienate so much of this movement to have your way in politics? Stick to the topic at hand and take your blinders off: conservatives just unanimously reauthorized VAWA, and the right's poster-boy signed off on its funding without the law even clearing the house and senate committees, so get off your high-horse already, the right holds no high ground in this battle. Conservatives have held office during most of radical feminism's reign, and are therefore fully responsible for their part in the creation of the misandric society in which we live.
Stick to men's activism. Feminism has poisoned both the right and left wings of politics with its hate and greedy demands.
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by thatold55 on 08:12 PM February 5th, 2006 EST (#9)
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RandomPerson said:
He decimated hundreds of innocent peoples' lives and careers with his witchhunting.
Could you name or or two of the innocent people whose lives were decimated?
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by RandomMan on 12:52 AM February 6th, 2006 EST (#10)
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It's RandomMAN, dipshit. I promise I checked my boxers before I called myself that. Hence the fucking name. As for misspelling my nick, if you want to be politically correct that badly, then go join the communists. They're the ones who came up with chairperson and personhole and all that other crap you apparently believe in strongly enough that it makes you misspell "Man". Good thing McCarthy isn't still in business: you'd be fucked.
But, since there's nothing on TV, I'll humor you. Let's start with John Henry Faulk. Background here. An interesting quote from Mr. Faulk:
In spite of the great hue and cry about traitors and a Communist conspiracy raised by Senator McCarthy and his imitators during the Red Scares, they never produced a single Communist spy whose guilt was proved in court. Nor was a single person ever indicted for treason, let alone tried for the crime. In other words, the whole Red Scare business, from beginning to end, stands condemned by history as a colossal fraud on the American public.
Next, you can read this. Sounds like 40 innocent military personnel were dismissed without cause, since they were eventually offered their jobs back. Being terminated from one's career under suspicion of criminal acts without proof qualifies as decimated to me. Shall I contact your Department of Defense to obtain the list of 40 names from this one small part of his witchhunt, or does that do it for you? Please don't tell me you're paranoid enough to try and call the Texas Observer or the Christian Science Monitor "leftist".
Now, why don't you have the common courtesy to answer a question for me and provide me with the names of one or two people that he actually caught, you know, people who were convicted of treason. Oh, wait a second, that's right, there weren't any. Sure, all sorts of falsely accused people "confessed" to various bullshit to save their own hides, but that doesn't make it true.
Now. Shall we get back to men's activism? Don't waste your breath replying if you're going to misspell my nick to be politically correct, I'll ignore you, or assume you're just trolling.
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by LSBeene on 05:26 AM February 6th, 2006 EST (#11)
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First off, I have to concede your point that we should concentrate on MRA issues. Your counsel on that is correct sir. That said, it does not mean that within the MRA community we can not debate, with decorum, our various views on various subjects. It does not, in my opinion sir, make us less cohesive, but rather we may speak to others, with other views, that we'd rather not run into. I find our diversity of views a good thing.
There are liberal MRAs, neo-con MRAs, Christian and atheist MRAs, black/asian/white/native MRAs, (sheesh - I sound like Forrest Gump: Fried shrimp, baked shrimp, gumbo shrimp ..) ... and while we do share a common cause, and are sometimes passionate about our views in all areas, I do not think that that is a bad thing. In the right measure if you catch my meaning.
Now, onto the McCarthy thing. No, no one was tried for treason, though many should have been. Who (since you asked for names)? Alger Hiss (convicted of perjury for denying being a Soviet spy), Ethel and Julius Rosenburg (both tried and executed for treason), Kim Philby, Judith Coplon (actually apprehended handing US counter-intel papers to a KGB officer), Harry Dexter White (ID'd by defectors, never charged, revealed as Sov spy by Venona Project - see below), Frank Coe and Solomon Adler (Sov agents/spies - directed Dept State money away from non-communists and TO communist govt's - known to FBI as Sov spy - confirmed by Venona), Lauchlin Currie (Sov spy - id'd by Venona Project), Duncan Lee (asst head of OSS - precursor to CIA - id'd as Sov spy - Venona), Harry Hopkins (special advisor to Pres FDR, defectors named him - never indicted, id'd by Venona), etc etc and the list goes on.
Venona Project, btw, was a Eyes-only project wherein the U.S. was "reading the Soviet mail" by decryption. Just like Ultra in WWII it was used sparingly so as not to tip off the Soviets. The projects results were released in 1995.
I now put it to you RandomMan, did you ever hear in the history books about ANY of this? And trust me, I cut the list WAY short just so this didn't turn into a book.
It turned out that many of the Sov-sympathizers were in power, vouched for their brothers and sisters (who were also spies), and made getting anywhere during the hearings almost impossible.
Again sir, have you been told this? Why is not a balanced report of what heppened, good and bad, not given by our leftist leaning schools? History has been twisted and rewritten.
You should read: "Treason" by Ann Coulter. Granted, the book I am refering to most assuredly is written by a conservative, but it is footnoted to the umpteenth degree with supporting documentation.
I hope we can agree to disagree on non-MRA politics, and still join forces against feminists excesses.
With sincere respect,
Steven
"Watch our backs at home, we'll guard the wall over here. Sleep safe tonight, we're on the job."
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by RandomMan on 11:06 AM February 6th, 2006 EST (#13)
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I agree, LSBeene, that you're right on with the Forrest Gump approach to MRAs - I just worry about people's motives. I fear that hatred can fill our ranks, when we should be sticking to the cause of justice. One sometimes accidentally results from the other, but someone driven by hate will always be driven by hate. Whoever wrote "American History X" had it right: "hate is baggage". It can only harm a movement like ours that seeks to stop hate as misandry, the hatred of men. Simply replacing it with misogyny will do us no good.
Also, I fully agree with your stance on debating other issues, but I try to stick to men's rights around here to avoid "hijacking" as you called it in another thread. That's all.
Actually, I knew about the Rosenbergs (there's a fictionalized account of the life of their son by E.L. Doctorow that's quite an excellent piece on the male ego and pschye called The Book of Daniel, not to be confused with the insipid TV show that's lifted the name.) I also recall several of the names (Philby, Hiss) from news reports and other accounts. I never said there weren't any spies, or that America wasn't or isn't justified in seeking to prosecute them. It's the wide-scale persecution and fear-mongering I'm worried about. McCarthy's approach grossly violated the rights of many of your countrymen, just as feminists are trying to do today.
There is no "balanced report" of it in the schools because McCarthy was a man, and in feminized schools, men are bad. Period. By teaching boys that's all they are, the feminists teach them to accept oppression and a back seat in the bus for the rest of their lives. I understand what you meant by the idea that the feminists (I think you confuse them with "the left") have buried the few positive outcomes of the "Red Scares".
Unfortunately, the only thing by or about Ann Coulter I intend to read is her obituary. She lacks journalistic integrity and has been demonstrated to be lying in most of her writing. Also, she relies on hate-driven ad hominem attacks instead of logic and argument, which renders her writing intellectually worthless. It's easy to lie with footnotes (lots of others have already covered this in detail, I won't). She's an ideologue and a demagogue, no better than the feminists we fight, even if her rhetoric opposes them on occasion. Hate doesn't do us any good, but it's easy to create and manipulate, which is why she succeeds. Sadly, hate is almost impossible to stop.
There's nothing wrong with conservative social and political positions, LSBeene, and I fully support your right to defend them. However, I also support the same rights for those on the political left and in the social progressive corner equally. I also maintain that the conservatives in office have been just as instrumental in giving away the farm to hateful feminists as the liberals are. Granted, the liberals would have us all apologizing for having testicles every time we opened our mouths, but still, the conservative governments of the last 40 years have done us no favors.
All that being said, stay safe, sir, since you've got sand in your boots and there's some folks around that mean to do you harm over there. I may not agree with America's motives for the war, but that doesn't mean for an instant I don't worry about any soldier in a combat zone.
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by Davidadelong on 11:03 AM February 6th, 2006 EST (#12)
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OK Guys, second attempt here, AOL booted me when I attempted the first time. Any information that is sanctioned by any "party" is controled by that "party" no matter what the premise of the "party" is. Which means that for any individual to accept the propaganda of any "party" without actually thinking about it makes you the perfect candidate for the title "Jar Head". Jar Head means that a Person allows someone else to input information without thought or consequences, a biological tape recorder if you will. I have read statements and snippets from people that have posted on this site that I totally agree with. That doesn't mean that I will follow those individuals because I happen to agree with a few things that they say. Any "PARTY" that has conspired against the FREEDOM and EQUALITY of HUMANITY is the enemy folks. The only reason they change their "line" is to gain more power, and keep the PEOPLE off balance. We have been taught in this country to believe "professionals", and to look up to them without question starting in kindergarten. People need to learn to think for themselves Folks. Why would anyone do anything to anybody that they would not want done to them? PLEASE, THINK things through, kick it around, taste it, try some real critical thinking as an individual HUMAN BEING; not a sheep following an inept shepherd. Just a thought, before it is to late, just a thought.....
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by MR on 10:22 AM February 5th, 2006 EST (#2)
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I find it the height of hypocrisy that the proceeds of the V-Monologues are going to "battered women's shelters," yet the original V-Monlogues had a segment called "The Little Couchy Snoorcher," that depicted the rape of a 12 or 13 year old girl by a lesbian. The original V-Monologues depicted this as a good thing, beneficial to the young girl. I've read that new showings of the V-Monogologues show this segment, but have now raised the young girl depicted to "legal age."
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by LSBeene on 10:37 AM February 5th, 2006 EST (#3)
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The Original in the play was called: "The Little Coochie Snorter Who Could" (or close to that - this is from memory)
In it she is 13, and remarks after he lesbian seduction: "If this was a rape, it was a good rape."
It was revised to make her 16.
I do not remember if alcohol was involved
"Reporting Live from the 'Sandbox'"
"Watch our backs at home, we'll guard the wall here. Sleep safe, we're on the job."
Steven
"Watch our backs at home, we'll guard the wall over here. Sleep safe tonight, we're on the job."
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by LSBeene on 07:05 PM February 5th, 2006 EST (#7)
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Ragtime,
First off thanks kindly for your words. Sincerely and heartfelt ... thanks.
May I address a few things here that may be off-topic. If what I do or non-MRA stuff bores you, just stop reading. No harm, no foul. This is an MRA forum and I respect that.
I can tell you all now, yes, we've had our "excitement" over here.
1st time was some lame-ass "rocket attack". I put that in quotes to let you know it was more annoying than anything. Try to imagine. Happy safe (and blond) Beene in his "pod" (our barracks) hears a "BOOM" "BOOM". We don the armor and hit the bunkers. We're in Southern Iraq and it's flat terrain, aint much to hide Hadji when he f*cks with us. 1st rocket detonates in Mid-air, second is a dud, and the third (in no particular order) misses the camp by 1/2 a kilometer the FOB (Forward Operating Base) is pretty big and those losers missed us by 1/2 a kilometer. Give-me-a-break. Go home Hadji - we're on the job.
============================================
We did have some fatalities recently. This is the part of my job I hate. Part of my job is to process the reports on this. Basically you have to imagine that the fog over here (yes, we have fog - we're near the Gulf) is THICK. A trailing HUMVEE was trailing a convoy. We are trained to "Own the road" and it was driving support. Our HUMVEE hit/was-hit head on w/a dump truck. Realize this: our Armored HUMVEEs are 10-13K pounds. The frame is compact and to make this short - the dump-truck came to rest 75-100 meters from impact and our HUMVEE was stopped hard and maybe went back 10-20 meters. The driver and gunner (most vulnerable) were killed.
They were not in "my" unit, but in a subordinate unit. One of mine. I knew them. Not well, and not to say I was their "buddy", but I knew them on sight, and had spoken to them.
Too many angels in uniform won't be coming home tonight. Heaven is brighter for their gain, .... and our loss.
===========================================
And, pardon me, but F*CK CNN ... we're winning. We recently helped the Iraqis vote. These people came in on buses, guarded by OUR gun trucks, braving death threats and rifle/RPG fire .... to V-O-T-E. Hell, here in the US when it RAINS we get a lower voter turn-out.
Recently, a soldier in my unit, took it upon himself, and got command permission, and got 51 packages. What was in them? Crayons and coloring books. I know, I helped hump those boxes to our command area. WHY did he do this? Because we believe in the people of Iraq. No, we aint naive. We're here and we know what time it is. That said, we believe.
We are undeterred.
-------------------------------------
(Warrior's ethos)
I will always place the mission first.
I will never accept defeat.
I will never quit.
I will never leave a fallen comrade.
================================================
Here are some links :
http://www.army.mil/SoldiersCreed/flash_version/in dex.html
http://www.grouchymedia.com/
==============================================
Try being here: the flavor of the words dedication, team work, and esprit-de-corps taste different when it counts.
Sorry if I hijacked the thread. It's late here and I post when I can, usually at the cost of sleep. But, I cannot express how proud I am of what I am doing. I could not, unless you could see my face and hear my words, tell you how many people I don't know write to us and send us packages.
F*ck CNN. I got a confirmation E-mail from Amazon.com the other day (I ordered some books and DVDs) and at the bottom, in a different script and color were words, personal words, from two employees:
"We support our troops. Come home soon, be safe. We believe in you."
Signed by two people I won't name for fear some ass-tard will target them for being kind.
Trust me, we're getting support here. From groups I aint heard of, packages and letters, and postcards and free magazines and movies and books and offers to be pen-pals. F*ck CNN.
===============================================
We like this one: DL it, imagine the words "We're coming mother f*cker" being said before the video)
http://www.grouchymedia.com/other_videos/americas_ defense/download.cfm
"Commin' at 'cha from every side:
I got a heart full of pain, hand full of stress,
Hand full of anger ... held in my chest
....
Because all of this stress gave me something to write on,
The pain gave me something I could set my sights on,
We'll never forget the blood sweat and tears,
The uphill struggle .. over years .. the fearin'
Trash talkin' .. and the people it was too ..
and the people that started it .. just like you (pic of Saddam)
"You guys watch our backs at home, we'll guard the wall here. Sleep safe, we're on the job."
With kindest thanks for the fellow MRA support, and with most gentle regards ...
Steven
------------------------------------------------
"Watch our backs at home, we'll guard the wall over here. Sleep safe tonight, we're on the job."
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by LSBeene on 07:11 PM February 5th, 2006 EST (#8)
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I apologize if anyone minded me spouting off. I'm beat and it just flowed out.
I hope you guys know where my heart was when I wrote it and I, again, apologize if I hijacked anything.
"You guys watch our backs at home, we'll guard the wall here. Sleep safe, we're on the job."
L. Steven Beene II
-Serving Proudly
"Watch our backs at home, we'll guard the wall over here. Sleep safe tonight, we're on the job."
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by Davidadelong on 10:49 AM February 5th, 2006 EST (#4)
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I have never seen the play, the idea of a talking pussy gave me the shudders, similar to a snapping one, and those exist! For all you Men out there that live in OR, you know how pc the Eugene/Springfield area is, and let us not forget Portland. Springfield was holding out, but money talks. I saw a highway sign for this play a few years ago, I am sure they will play it here again. Again I won't go see it, and I will make fun of anyone that does, unless it is for research.
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by Thundercloud on 02:43 PM February 6th, 2006 EST (#14)
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Hey, David-
Did you happen to see that episode of "FAMILY GUY" where they spoofed the "V-monologues".
It was just a pair of female legs, with a MOUTH between them, yakking up on stage.
YES! They actually SHOWED that!
I had to laugh.
Thundercloud.
"Hoka hey!"
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by Davidadelong on 04:18 PM February 6th, 2006 EST (#15)
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No, I did not, but your description gave me a laugh anyhow! Thanks for the humor, I needed that! "Hoka hey!" Thundercloud, by the way, most mouths have teeth!
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by Thundercloud on 12:51 PM February 7th, 2006 EST (#16)
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This one DID have teeth.
Made it all the funnier.
Thundercloud.
"Hoka hey!"
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From e-mailed announcement, posted with permission: