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I can´t give you any sources, but this happened to a friend of mine.The girl said he raped her and so (without evedence) he spend 30 days in jail before she finally admitted she made it up. He was released and was awarded 3000$ in damages from her (I think she should be put in jail for 60 days to teach her a valuable lesson!).
This was in Sweden so he probably get better of than had it happened in the US. She probably wouldn´t have gotten into any trouble if that was the case.
Apparently she had regretts about having sex the day after and told her parents she had been raped. What kind of society breeds these sort of girls? A FEMINIST society! A "no" is a "no" and so is a "yes"...
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by Anonymous User on Tuesday December 18, @09:42AM EST (#29)
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Apparently she had regretts about having sex the day after and told her parents she had been raped. What kind of society breeds these sort of girls? A FEMINIST society! A "no" is a "no" and so is a "yes"...
This is a bunch of crap, frankly. "Feminism" is the theory that women should be treated equally along with men. I'm sorry that you're against that. But it has nothing to do with no or yes meaning no, or anything of the kind.
Maybe girls wouldn't make false accusations of rape for attention if they were taught early on in life that they had value beyond just their bodies. This is the way that most preteen girls think, particularly in America. It's the media and our patriarchal society that makes them this way. If it were really a female-controlled society, wouldn't women get paid more, or at least the same as men for doing the same work?
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Look, here's an opportunity for us to ignore a troll!
:)
Scott
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Look, here's an opportunity for us to ignore a troll!
Indeed, and so I will, even though I have this incredibly strong urge to tell our troll a few things about equality and gender feminism. Perhaps I'll just suggest reading Wendy McElroy's latest column which will be posted here a bit later.
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False accusation of men has been a massive social problem since the early eighties when women's trash TV (women's talk shows) used feminist political tricks to manipulate women into watching their shows. They ran thousands and thousands of hours of shows saying that men are rapists, child molesters, wife beaters, sexual abusers etc. They did this for at about fifteen years and it caused women to make thousands of false accusations against men. These false accusations are still being made.
The female criminals who commit these crimes are almost always set free because the feminists have managed to infiltrate and manipulate the area of law enforcement.
One of the feminist tricks is to say that false accusers should not be prosecuted because it will deter other women from making an accusation against a man.
It is truly amazing that law-enforcement fell for such an obvious anti-masculine trick but they did - big time!
This single feminist trick has allowed many female criminals to walk away free.
Another feminist political trick (which has already been mentioned) is to use the "blaming the victim" tactic.
This trick makes sure that a woman can make false accusations for any reason she chooses without even having to back up her story. Again, it is truly incredible that the authorities fell for this anti-masculine feminist tactic - but they did - again big time!
Even another feminist trick is to make sure that the accused is named in the press and on TV etc (so destroying his life) while the false accusers name is kept secret - so a woman can attack a man for any reason she chooses - without any social consequences.
Yet another feminist trick is to make sure that the accusers history is not allowed to be spoken of - even if she is a habitual false accuser.
With social consequences and legal consequences totally removed, feminists have made it possible for women to falsely accuse any man she chooses for any reason she chooses.
THIS, my brothers is covert matriarchal politics in action.
Let's work to remove feminist politics from the justice system.
FALSELY ACCUSE A MAN - GO TO JAIL!
(For at least the amount of time that the man would have gone to jail had he been wrongly convicted)
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Here's an article from Britain's The Times, published last Saturday, December 15, 2001.
The man spent three years in prison for a crime that he didn't commit, a crime that never took place. Note the statments from Lord Justice Mance that she (the false-accuser) was "a troubled young woman. She was confused about her sexuality. She thought she wasn’t getting enough attention from her mother," and the "wrong... had been keeping her awake, crying all night." Ooooh, the poor girl. Note that the so-called justice refers to the false-accusers action as a "wrong" rather than a "crime."
Gee, could it be that (mainstream/radical/gender) feminists like to see this sort of thing happen? Perhaps the sickos want all men to be locked in prison.
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Gee, could it be that (mainstream/radical/gender) feminists like to see this sort of thing happen? Perhaps the sickos want all men to be locked in prison.
In fact, Thomas, we have posted several articles to MANN in the past which featured gender feminist columnists advocating FOR false accusations of sexual assault against men, under the argument that it would "put fear" into us.
You can read one of them here.
Gender feminists claim to be concerned about a "chilling effect" if false accusations are aggressively prosecuted. The truth is, they enjoy men being falsely accused and imprisoned.
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Ignoring trolls are cool! :-)
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I brought this subject up with my partner and he revealed something shocking. One of his ex-gfs once threatened to accuse him of rape. He managed to stave off the accusations by threatening to report HER to the authorities. She had a slew of false aliases, along with various fake documents that she was using in attempts to perpetrate fraud.
That got her to shut up.
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That got her to shut up.
Your partner is a wise man. I'm glad he came out of that situation unscathed as far as a criminal record.
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Kind of a side topic but has anyone else noticed that accourding to the FBI men can not be raped. (their definition of rape is VERY specific and only includes women.)
The basic fact is that women can accuse men of rape, abuse, harrassment or any other crime and the man is treated as guilty until proven innocent. Even if the male wins the court case the public media attention given to the arrest is enourmous while the attention given to the innocent, falsely accused victim is minimal or non-existent.
also in the wonderful world of sexual politics of men and women, a "no" does not always mean "no." There have been a few studies that show women sometimes say "no" to sex inititally because they dont want to seem easy.the mixed messages men get of a woman saying "no", "no", "no" but physically acting "yes", "yes", "yes" is very confusing. This doesn't mean that a "no" shouldn't be take at face value but women should take responsibility for the confusing situtation they place men in as well.
Tony H
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Topless dancer Nina Shahravan made, then later retracted false allegations against Dallas Cowboys football players.
http://www.usc.edu/student-affairs/dt/V130/N09/02- false.09v.html
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by Anonymous User on Monday December 17, @11:32AM EST (#3)
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I was accused once, in a roundabout sort of way, but fortunately the charge was recanted before the police were involved. She never accused me outright in the beginning, but then her story snowballed, as her friends started giving her the sort of attention from them she had been craving. So she essentially made false rape accusations for the attention she got. Fortunately I just happened to have a picture of us happily having breakfast the next morning, and the details sufficiently contradicted her story enough that she came clean, at least to her close friends.
Not quite the same thing, but I have a male friend who's ex-girlfriend lied about him abusing her so that she could get into some special housing for grad students. She wasn't really thinking about what her lie would do to my friend, who was attending the same school, since they had just broken up.
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Of course, I wrote a story about my own false accusations experience for The Guy Code but said Web site apparently deleted it from their archives.
Sigh.
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I remembered a famous case that involved the self-righteous black activist leader Al Sharpton and a woman. I couldn't remember the name of the woman who was involved and did a search on google.
here is one of the sites on there.
http://www.premises-liability.net/fr_archive.html
Tony H
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by Anonymous User on Monday December 17, @12:41PM EST (#6)
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Warren Farrell and references a study done by the U.S. Air Force in The Myth of Male Power. The Air Force took hundreds of military women who made rape accusations and decided to investigate. Eventually, about 28% recanted, most of them doing so either just before taking a lie detector test or right after failing one. Then they quesioned them about the motives. The most common was "spite or revenge," but others included covering up an affair, mental illness, self-guilt, leverage for promotions, etc.
Marc
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You know, this really gets my blood boiling: feminists saying that there are NO false accusations of rape. It seems that almost every week I read or hear about a man being set free from prison because his rape accuser came forward and admitted she lied, or some other evidence had cleared him.
If you want some good evidence, I suggest you go to the newspaper archives at the f.a.c.t. website (www.fact.on.ca). When you get to the site, click on the "Newspaper Articles" section on the left, and then click on "Go to the News Index" link. Finally, click on "August 1-August 31 2001" and you will get about 10 articles on the Cathy Fordham/Jamie Nelson case. Basically, Nelson spent 3 years in prison because of her lies. The judge chose to convict him simply on her word, even though she had a questionable story. Furthermore, shortly before this false rape conviction, Nelson was involved in a bitter custody dispute with his soon to be ex-wife, and it just happened to be the case that Cathy Fordham was her best friend. So how and why was he finally set free? Nelson's lawyers discovered that Fordham was a serial liar; she tried this on other men, and was in fact convicted for the false allegations (but only spent 6 months under house arrest).
There is NO was in which the above example was a result of mistaken identity.
Also, you might want to search the web for the Catherine Webb story. Feminists might argue that she had made a mistake in accusing Gary Dotson (sp?) of rape, except for one thing; the rape never happened.
He will never be the same. He will never change.
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A man in Huntsville, Alabama was falsely accused of raping two women. It was the late 80s or early 90s. After he'd been in jail a few days they told police they lied because they were mad at him for refusing to give them some money. End of story. No charges filed against either of them.
There have also been several cases of men freed from prison after the women who falsely accused them came forward years later and admitted they had lied. One received substantial coverage in the mid 1990s. I don't remember names or places, though, except United States.
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The woman's name was Tawana Brawley, a black teenager who very effectively played both rape and race cards, to the great (if temporary) profit of Sharpton and other demagogues. As usual, those she accused in her rather wild story were instantly found guilty in the national press, and suffered years of trouble. A Google search returned about 2000 cites, including http://eightiesclub.tripod.com/id136.htm, which seems to tell the story pretty well.
Andrew
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"It's a lame situation, but please don't start to look down on women as malicious and lying. For every one who falsely accuses of rape, there are dozens who are actually raped who never come forward. To put this in context, I know of 9 women personally who were raped, and I've seen 0 rape trials. So the % of convictions based on a false accusation in my group of friends is 0%. Percentage of rapists who go free, possibly to do it again: 100%."
This may be true. But the point is that male victims (either of rape or of false accusations), as a statistical category, get almost no attention from the justice system and the media. We spend millions of dollars studying rapes of college women but essentially nothing on prison rape. Who commits the most rapes is not the point. The point is which victims are more ignored. The prevalence and seriousness of the ways in which men are raped (in prison and, psychologically by rape false accusations) is almost totally ignored. There is data available on the issue, but it goes for the most part untold.
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I was also once accused, it was in high school and I had had sex with this girl(actually she had been hitting on me and approached me about it), after we had sex, she was under the assumption that we were now an item. After I set her straight, I heard nothing more from her. About six months later after I had graduated, I heard from a few people that she had said that I raped her(in the date rape sense). I was in shock and scared. Granted I was a player but I had never raped a girl and never even coerced someone into having sex. The girl never went to the police but I know that there are still people out there that think I'm a rapist.
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I was also once accused,
You have my sympathies, TheTruHepKat. I have never been accused of rape, but I was once accused of hitting my ex-girlfriend in high school. Like yours, she never went to the police, but by the time she was "through" with me, the whole town believed I was a violent woman-abuser.
I wrote about this incident not long ago for The Guy Code, but I think I should repost it here, if I can find it again.
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Please do repost it here, if you can, Nightmist. I too have been falsely accused -- of sex discrimination. It was so blatently false that it never went further than the public accusation, but, of course, nothing was done to so much as reprimand the woman who told the obvious lie.
I know other men who have been falsely accused by women. There is, in fact, a pandemic of false accusations against men in this feminist society.
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by Anonymous User on Wednesday December 19, @09:55AM EST (#62)
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My my Nightmist, TWO false accusations in the one lifetime... or is there more? You must be one very unlucky man.
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Hmmm. Looks like a mainstream feminist troll laughing at the pain suffered by a man at the hands of vicious women.
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Hmmm. Looks like a mainstream feminist troll laughing at the pain suffered by a man at the hands of vicious women.
Looks like she doesn't read very well, either. I have no idea what *two* false accusations she's referring to. The false accusation I mentioned in this thread is the same one I posted.
I do wish people would consider comprehending what they read before they post their moronic thoughts about it to the Internet for the whole world to see.
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Uhhh, what *two* false accusations are you referring to?
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by Anonymous User on Monday December 17, @12:45PM EST (#7)
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Met a girl. She sparked my interest as a companion. Got close. Lent her a substantial amount of money. She broke up with me. Called her back asking her to repay me. A few days later cops show up at my door with a court summons. She lied and claimed I "pushed her" once. Court never asked me for any testimony. It was an easy for her to dispose of her responsibilities from me (pay me back).
Found out later that she has done this to someone else too. She already is "set up" with alimony , she knows how to work the system that is set up to wreck havoc in men's lives. I would hate to have her mad at me, a false rape accusation seems like a destruction tool she would use. I feel bad for any man that ends up in her life...
Bad women will lie when the legal system enables them to be above the law and denies evidentiary hearings for proof of guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.
As my lawyer said to me, the system was set up to be a "shield" against violent persons, but has ended up being used as a sword in domestic issues.
If woman will lie about abuse, why would they be above lying about rape????
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I don't know of any feminists (or women) who claim there are no false rape claims.
There are people in jail for murders they didn't commit and there are any number of other less serious crimes in which an innocent person is either framed or incorrectly indicted.
I was once on a jury in a rape case where I voted to acquit the man. The story just didn't add up to me. (And believe me, I was ready to put the guy away before the trial got under way). All three women on the jury voted to acquit so I don't think women are unqualified to be objective on the matter of rape.
I also have a very close relative who was raped and went through the entire legal process with her. It was wrenching. Based on this experience I can't say it would be easy to bring a false claim. Given what she went through I don't think a successfully convicting on a false claim would be possible. Ok, not impossible but would take an extreme amount of effort and careful planning and outsmarting of the system. I don't think someone of moderate to lesser intelligence could pull it off, and especially not as a last minute retaliatory act. Maybe jurisdictions vary.
My relative lost her case and she WAS most definetly raped, by a professor no less. (He was indicted again 2 years later by another student and lost). I'm convinced the guilty go free more often than false claims. I haven't seen any studies on this but that's my gut reaction.
The legal system isn't always fair but the burden of proof is still greatly weighted on the side of prosecution, not defense, as it should be for such serious crimes.
I do feel people who bring false claims should be very harshly punished.
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I don't know of any feminists (or women) who claim there are no false rape claims.
I have had two women, on two separate occasions, tell me that no woman would accuse a man of rape unless he had done it. One gave the "reasoning" that women (supposedly) go through such terrible treatment at a trial that they would never put themselves through it unless the accusation were true. The other didn't even bother to give a justification for the declaration.
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by Anonymous User on Monday December 17, @02:42PM EST (#12)
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"My relative lost her case and she WAS most definetly raped, by a professor no less. (He was indicted again 2 years later by another student and lost). I'm convinced the guilty go free more often than false claims. I haven't seen any studies on this but that's my gut reaction."
Who was this professor?
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by Anonymous User on Tuesday December 18, @05:16AM EST (#25)
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Almost certainly more guilty go free than innocent are convicted. That's true for ANY crime. But it totally misses the point. The law is designed that way on the theory that it's better to let 10 guilty go free than to convict one innocent. So, when DNA evidence time and time again is demonstrating the innocence of men in prison who were falsely accused of rape, then we should start asking whether the anti-male bias that so many men (and women) attest to is in fact real. And we should be protecting the names of the accused just as we do the names of the accusers. AND, most importantly, we need to start talking about it and be willing to publish the available data on it no matter how "controversial" it is. That's precisely what we're not doing.
Marc
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Given what she went through I don't think a successfully convicting on a false claim would be possible. Ok, not impossible but would take an extreme amount of effort and careful planning and outsmarting of the system.
A conviction in court is not the only threat faced by a man who is accused. Even if he didn't commit the crime, even if the crime never occurred, his life may very well be ruined by the accusation.
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by Anonymous User on Tuesday December 18, @05:11AM EST (#24)
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Lorianne: "There are people in jail for murders they didn't commit and there are any number of other less serious crimes in which an innocent person is either framed or incorrectly indicted."
You raise good issues Lorianne. Your your emphasis on convictions misses an important point. Whether or not there is a conviction, a person falsely accused of rape, and especially a male (because of the bias), is usually "raped" by the resulting emotional and reputational damage.
All the articles we read of innocent men being released after decades of imprisonment are probably just a small sample of the number of innocent men who were convicted and imprisoned. But they are also tip of the iceberg for men who were falsely accused altogether, convicted or not, and who are damaged for life because of it.
Also, aside from the bias against males, we practice a major double-standard when we protect the name of the complainant but not the name of the accused.
Incidentally, another documented example of false accusations is the famous Scottsborough trial(s), in which police asked several white women (who were avoiding police for certain reasons) whether a certain group of black men raped them, and they (to divert attention from themselves) falsely answered 'yes'.
Marc
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http://www.vix.com/pub/men/falsereport/index.html
more-general information
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Just as we say not all men are rapists, I think we can accurately say that not all rape accusations are false. Over the summer there were several women in my neighborhood that were raped by the same man, who happened to live around the corner from my house. He would follow them into their homes, or go in through an unlocked door or window window. It was a very frightening time on our block. They caught him, luckily.
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Just as we say not all men are rapists, I think we can accurately say that not all rape accusations are false.
I don't think anyone here made the claim that all rape accusations are false. Just because they aren't all false doesn't mean you should deny the accused due process and assume guilt.
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I am not advocating that we should deny due process, nor that we should assume guilt. I just am concerned that there will be a return to the "blame the victim" days when if a woman is raped it was her own fault and not that of the rapist.
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I am not advocating that we should deny due process, nor that we should assume guilt. I just am concerned that there will be a return to the "blame the victim" days when if a woman is raped it was her own fault and not that of the rapist.
While that's a valid concern, I sincerely doubt there's any chance of that happening any time soon. Rape cases should be treated (in terms of the accused) as are most other criminal cases: guilty until proven innocent. These days, it's more likely to be the other way around specifically *because* everyone is concerned about blaming the victim.
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by Anonymous User on Tuesday December 18, @05:19AM EST (#26)
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Agreed. And not only that, but even in the so-called days of "blame the victim," men who were either poor, disliked, black, etc. were easily hung without even a trial based on the accusation of a woman.
Marc
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by Anonymous User on Tuesday December 18, @06:16AM EST (#27)
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I'm obviously doing something wrong here with these postings. I responded to several people but it looks like I'm responding to myself. Must be the new changes.
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by Anonymous User on Tuesday December 18, @09:39AM EST (#28)
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While that's a valid concern, I sincerely doubt there's any chance of that happening any time soon. Rape cases should be treated (in terms of the accused) as are most other criminal cases: guilty until proven innocent. These days, it's more likely to be the other way around specifically *because* everyone is concerned about blaming the victim.
I don't think everyone is concerned about blaming the victim. We had a discussion on a community awareness list here at school, and most people said, "well, women who are irresponsible and go to parties and wear skirts get raped. They should be smarter." It's ridiculous, and it still happens, even in the most "liberal," "feminist" places. And it sucks.
As for false accusations of rape, all I can say is this: statistics that you assemble regarding what % of convictions were based on false accusations will never tell the whole story. The vast majority of women who are actually raped never come forward. This is the reason why the system seems to lean toward conviction. If someone is a rapist, he (she) will probably rape 10 or more victims before one will come forward, so a conviction is especially pressing. The attention this merits for victims who come forward make it not-so-surprising that some women would make up false claims of rape.
It's a lame situation, but please don't start to look down on women as malicious and lying. For every one who falsely accuses of rape, there are dozens who are actually raped who never come forward. To put this in context, I know of 9 women personally who were raped, and I've seen 0 rape trials. So the % of convictions based on a false accusation in my group of friends is 0%. Percentage of rapists who go free, possibly to do it again: 100%.
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I found it interesting that the statistics you found say that 60-75% male rape perpetrators are female. I know 3 men who were sexually assaulted (as boys or teens) and in all three cases the perpetrator was a male relative.
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by Anonymous User on Tuesday December 18, @01:13PM EST (#34)
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"I found it interesting that the statistics you found say that 60-75% male rape perpetrators are female. I know 3 men who were sexually assaulted (as boys or teens) and in all three cases the perpetrator was a male relative."
How "cutsie" - another unsubstantiated feminist emotional appeal about sexual assault. You have been conditioned well by the feminist elite.
It is hard to determine what exactly your point is, but I think you have implied that based on your own relations that a large percentage of people have been assaulted by men regardless of sex. How this relates to the topic of false allegations is unlcear, but either you are lying, work as some sort of therapist or statistically you are at some odd extreme.
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No, I am not. I am neither feminist nor anti-male, nor lying. I do know three men who were molested by an older cousin or uncle. I didn't say that I denied the statistic listed, merely that I found it interesting as it is counter to the three men that I know. One of whom being my ex-husband. Don't get into some false accusation hysteria.
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by Anonymous User on Tuesday December 18, @02:01PM EST (#40)
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Ok then, your personal experiences are at some odd extreme... but still, subjective in relation to the topic here.
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I just don't think that the very, very real problem of male on male violence should be ignored in the quest to attain equality. Now, it could be, that there is more of a stigma against male-on-male sexual abuse and that is why men's rights groups seem to ignore it more than they do female-on-male sexual abuse. Is that it?
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I just don't think that the very, very real problem of male on male violence should be ignored in the quest to attain equality. Now, it could be, that there is more of a stigma against male-on-male sexual abuse and that is why men's rights groups seem to ignore it more than they do female-on-male sexual abuse. Is that it?
Considering this thread is about false accusations made by women and not about true incidents of sexual abuse, I don't think you can make the argument that we are ignoring male-on-male abuse. MANN has run innumerable stories about the abuse of men in general, whether by women or men.
You also cannot expect us to run every story of abuse which pops up in the media. We run the stories which are of specific interest to men's issues. For instance, a story about a man who was victimized and did not get justice because he was male would be a story you might find here. It is unfortunate, but also true, that the majority of the cases in which the male victim does not get justice are female-on-male.
In other words, the volume of male-on-male versus the volume of female-on-male doesn't matter. The inequality in the justice system is what matters, and that is what this entire thread is about.
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by Anonymous User on Tuesday December 18, @02:57PM EST (#46)
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"I just don't think that the very, very real problem of male on male violence should be ignored in the quest to attain equality. Now, it could be, that there is more of a stigma against male-on-male sexual abuse and that is why men's rights groups seem to ignore it more than they do female-on-male sexual abuse. Is that it?"
You obviously have a hard time dealing with accounts of false accusations and the breakdown of constitutional liberties in the contemporary legal system, as you seem compelled to make this an issue where men are again in the assumed role of sexual aggressor.
Personally I think male on male sexual abuse should be examined without the political correctness stigma that denies that homosexuality is a major contributing factor in it. It is well known that gay men worship the young male archetype...
But, this is a different issue all together, as we could just as easily examine the sexual abuse of young children by mothers...
lets stay on topic
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Is this link more on topic then?
http://www.crimelibrary.com/news/ctv1.htm
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Nothing more was meant by my last post (the link) than that I get frustrated being called cutesy and a liar, by people who don't know me at all.
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Nothing more was meant by my last post (the link) than that I get frustrated being called cutesy and a liar, by people who don't know me at all.
Then perhaps you should have responded to the individual who called you those things, rather than to me. Regarding the link, yes, it is *more* on-topic, but because this site is about men's issues, it is a link probably more suited to ifeminists.com.
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Why? I think that the reason the feminism movement is floundering is because the gender feminists whitewashed women as the ultimate victims and ignored the very real evil that some women do, or tried to chalk up that evil as further evidence of the victim status. The men's movement ought not to fall into that same trap, and try to defend what evil some men do as further evidence of their own victim status.
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The men's movement ought not to fall into that same trap, and try to defend what evil some men.
Perhaps I missed something. Where did anyone here try to defend what evil some men do?
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Many of the threads on this site are "women do it too" threads. That is on the same footing, to me, as "all men are rapists" and yada yada from the feminists.
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Many of the threads on this site are "women do it too" threads. That is on the same footing, to me, as "all men are rapists" and yada yada from the feminists.
Excuse me? You believe that saying, for example, a woman can commit an act of violence just like a man can is on the same footing as "all men are rapists?" Where in the hell did that come from? Nobody I've seen here said "all women" do *anything.*
You're reading *far* too much into what you read here, WS.
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by Anonymous User on Tuesday December 18, @08:56PM EST (#57)
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"Many of the threads on this site are "women do it too" threads. That is on the same footing, to me, as "all men are rapists" and yada yada from the feminists."
Even if this comment reflected the basic premise behind many discussions here, which it does not, feminism as an institution has affected the rights of men everywhere. Feminism has set up special interest groups protecting the supposed inequalities that exist in institutions and the legal system to the point that it is men that receive greater sentencing for similar crimes that women commit, and face biased courts that have dimminished constitutional safeguards that are the foundation of a free society, and lack specific representation as women now do.
The current approach that feminism has taken to cure issues like domestic violence and sexual harassment are based in the phallacy that men have organized a "patriarchal" sytem of abuse to keep women down.
If feminism looked at the real issues behind abuse (i.e. drugs and drinking, social pathologies - poverty, broken families, mental disorders) then they might help the society. But instead feminism has focused it's social engineering on power for the most privilaged class of people that have ever walked this earth -upper middle class women.
No one here has denied that rape does exist. What is of concern here is the breakdown of equality by sexist feminist laws that are not based on empirical reason, but rather hyperbole misandry.
Ched
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feminism has focused it's social engineering on power for the most privilaged class of people that have ever walked this earth -upper middle class women.
Well put, Ched. I would just add the word, "white," to this. The upper-middle-class and upper-income, white women of today are far and away the most privileged and spoiled group of people in history.
Ain't no contest.
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by Anonymous User on Tuesday December 18, @11:32PM EST (#59)
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Well put, Ched. I would just add the word, "white," to this. The upper-middle-class and upper-income, white women of today are far and away the most privileged and spoiled group of people in history.
Ain't no contest.
Sorry Thomas.
I'll have to disagree. I'd say upper-middle-class black women. You see, they can play two victim cards, not just one. And not only do black women benefit from Gov't programs set up to deal with women's concerns, but they also get to hook in with other programs and organizations set up to deal with their concerns as members of a minority race. And think of the bonus they bring to any potential employer -- minority and a woman! Two for one!
As a white male, of course, I get none of these things. Indeed, if there is any racial group more politically incorrect I am not aware of it.
But I'm not here to play victim, even though I will be honest with you and say that once or twice in my life I can be almost totally sure that my race disadvantaged me. And in a few cases, I'm pretty sure it advantaged me. The larger thing is that my sex has nearly always disadvantaged me, and that is why me and you are men's activists dispite the difference in our racial heritage.
I also suggest that we share the same American value of freedom. In the past, Thomas, my white compatriots , if they chose, could have treated black people equally. Could have let them earn their way into the American dream, and let them enjoy the rights that all people should have. The shame is that they , for the most part, didn't do so.
Mowadays there is becoming less and less freedom for everyone, and soon there will be none for anyone to have. This is partly because feminism and many of the larger social movements are collectivist in the way they treat economic problems, and are enamored of the rights of "groups" rather than individuals.
Remo
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I would prefer to avoid any racial discussion, not because it isn't relevant but because I think for the purposes of gender they are exclusive. (FYI: race is a social construction.)Black men suffer more than white males or black females in category you can think of. I use this as an example in feminist arguments because the statistics are so easy to find and prove.
BUT "racism" is still a very entrenched institutional system in our society. It is a very complex issue and I will not attempt to discuss it here.
In general, white women benefit more than black women from the gender bias system gives them. They have more knowledge about their rights, more time address their concerns, more attention from the media and politicians.
In general minorities are trying to deal with other biases in the system to jump on the steamroller of feminism agenda.
Tony H
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by Anonymous User on Wednesday December 19, @09:34AM EST (#61)
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(FYI: race is a social construction.)
Yes and no. Obviously what to make of race is a social construction.
However, even "race"- critic George Winkel concedes some use to human classifications:
" Dr. Blumenbach as all the other "race" hypothesizers failed because no material (detrimental) difference can be shown ranking the various peoples of the world. Racial traits, are obvious, easily seen features; certainly they are inherited among "extremely extended family" populations. They clearly are somatic variations correlated with geographic regions. Many racial traits are almost certainly evolved adaptations to climatic conditions where the populations sharing them are/were native. The traits almost certainly evolved by Darwinian natural selection -- although they seem subtle, non-vital to anyone’s acclimatization anywhere now -- and they may be admired features. "
These inherited group traits (such as ability to handle lactase and frequency/susceptibilities to certain diseases) do have public health implications, at the very least.
However, whatever you think of "race" as a concept, there is not a person in the world who gives up their humanity because of where they were born, or what they look/act like genetically. I trust we are mostly ( if not all ) egalitarians here. :)
Remo
Remo
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That is interesting because I think that by and large false allegations of sexual assault are simply an exercise in power. Yet in my case the complainant, my daughter, was coerced into making the allegation by her mother, at least that is my claim and was the position of the police investigators as well. She may have felt also that she needed to feel some sense of control of her fate during this time as her mother had been temporarily incarcerated and she was living with neighbors at the time and this behavior was such an attempt.
My 5 year old son began making similar allegations against me a few months after my daughter made them. The only thing that saved my life was the fact that he made allegations about occurrences during times that I was exercising my visitation rights. I had never allowed myself to be alone with the boy when exercising my visitation rights. I was permitted to have unsupervised access to him by court order but I declined to do so and "ALLWAYS" had another adult present at "ALL" times. In fact the investigating detectives commented on the reality that my actions to protect myself had saved "everyone" a great deal of work.
What is significant about your observation is that I think that males are unlikely to make false allegations about sexual assault (in general). Women seem to be comfortable even joyful in portraying themselves as victims. Men just don't tend to see themselves like that even when it is true. I have even been challenged here for deluding myself that I was "not" a victim of misogyny.
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I am not sure if we are building a library of resources or not:
Scientific American
The U.S. has gone through a historically unparalleled expansion in its prison population--from fewer than 400,000 in 1970 to almost 2.1 million in 2000. The expansion continued vigorously even as crime rates fell sharply in recent years. And it has happened at all levels--federal, state and local. For explanations of the causes of the increase, it is helpful to examine the state prisons, which account for 63 percent of all adult prisoners, and the local jails, which account for another 32 percent. (The remainder are held mostly in federal prisons.) Because state laws and policies affect the number of prisoners in local jails, it is proper to consider the two types of institutions together.
source
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I've read hypotheses of MSBP as the possible cause of JonBenet Ramsey's death. But that is just one of the many hypotheses of that tragedy, I wouldn't put any credence in it necessarily.
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Oyez, Oyez, Oyez-A U.S. Supreme Court Database of
Northwestern University
This site provides access to a database of Supreme Court
cases with texts of opinions and recordings of oral arguments for recent cases.
A separate database contains biographical information on all justices of the
Supreme Court and links to their opinions.
Historic
file of Supreme Court Opinions
The Fed World site contains a searchable database of Supreme
Court opinions issued between 1937 and 1975.
Cornell Legal
Information Institute-Selected Historic Decisions of the U.S. Supreme Court
This site contains all Supreme Court opinions issued since
May 1990 and collection of nearly 600 opinions issued throughout the history of
the Court.
Supreme Court
Historical Society
The society’s site provides access to historical
publications of the society, the opinions of notable cases of the past 45
years, and information of the society’s programs.
U.S. Courts of Appeals
U.S.
Court of Appeals for the Fifth Circuit
This site includes a brief history of the John Minor Wisdom
U.S. Courthouse in New Orleans.
U.S.
Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit
An online version of a booklet describing the history of the
federal judicial system with special emphasis on the courts of the Ninth
Circuit.
U.S. District Courts
U.S.
District Court for the Southern District of Illinois
A brief chronology of the court’s history.
U.S.
District Court for the Southern District of Iowa
A brief history of the district.
U.S.
District Court for the Western District of Pennsylvania
This site includes a history of the district, a list of
judges with years of service, and brief biographies for all currently sitting
active and senior judges.
U.S.
District Court for the Southern District of Texas
A short history of the courts and lists of judges and clerks
who have served the court.
U.S.
District Court for the Western District of Washington
A brief description of the court’s history and former
courthouses.
Library and Archives Sites
National Archives and Records
Administration
The National Archives and Records Administration provides an
on line guide to federal records, including the those
of the federal courts, and information regarding the
regional research centers that house most federal court records.
This extensive site also has information regarding
publications, exhibits, and education programs.
U.S.
Judicial Branch Resources
This Library of Congress site links to numerous sites
related to the Annotated Constitution, the U.S. Code, federal regulations,
judicial opinions, court rules, and law journals.
Guide
to Legal History Sources on the Web
This site of the Tarlton Law Library at the University of
Texas at Austin provides links to legal history resources of courts,
universities, and research libraries.
H-LAW
H-LAW is an on line discussion list devoted to legal and
constitutional history. The H-Law web site contains logs of H-LAW discussions,
book reviews, and links to the American Society for Legal History.
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Freedom Tastes Sweet As Ordeal Ends
BY RAY RIVERA
THE SALT LAKE TRIBUNE
Sunday, November 15,1998
http://www.sltrib.com/1998/nov/11151998/utah/61837 .htm
OREM -- Ted Petrossi was a former Marine trying to put his marriage back
together when suddenly, inexplicably, his life fell apart.
A trusted friend accused him of sneaking a key, slipping into her
apartment and raping her. After a hasty investigation and a two-day trial,
Petrossi -- once a brig guard in the military -- was behind bars serving
back-to-back sentences of 5-years-to-life.
In the months that followed, a young public defender newly assigned to
Petrossi's case would slowly uncover a vault of new evidence all pointing to
a disturbing pattern: Petrossi's accuser, Amy Norr, had a long history of
falsely accusing men of sexual abuse.
Even more troubling: Norr's background of lying was well documented in
state records, but neither Petrossi's defense attorney, police nor
prosecutors uncovered those files for his trial. Nearly a decade earlier,
Utah County Attorney C. Kay Bryson -- then a deputy prosecutor -- had
dismissed charges against another man falsely accused by Norr.
Petrossi spent 21 months in prison before enough evidence was gathered
to free him last year. But freedom isn't the same thing as innocence,
Petrossi has learned.
Though his record has been cleared, his name hasn't. His accuser has
fled the state. Prosecutors won't apologize, and threaten to refile charges.
And Petrossi has been told that he can't sue or receive compensation for
the nearly two years removed from his life.
``What I would really like is something from the state saying, `Hey,
we're wrong, we're sorry, we do believe you,' '' said Petrossi, 43.
Petrossi's life was in shambles when he resigned from the Marines four
years ago as a staff sergeant. His wife, Jana Petrossi, had divorced him and
left their Barstow, Calif., home to return to Orem where she had grown up.
She took their five school-aged children with her.
The break-up was amicable, the result of a lot of little annoyances
after 15 years of marriage. But Petrossi wanted her back. In late 1994, he
moved to Orem and got a job at McDonald's and began courting his former
bride.
Jana Petrossi, 41, lived in the Lakeridge Apartments and worked as a
supervisor at Wal-Mart. She befriended a neighbor named Amy Norr, a petite
woman who, like Jana, was a divorced mother. They took care of each other's
children.
``She seemed to be a nice, caring person,'' Jana Petrossi said.
Ted Petrossi visited his ex-wife and kids daily, and soon became friends
with Norr as well. His plan to remarry Jana, meanwhile, was in full swing.
The couple already was discussing wedding dates.
On March 22, 1996, those plans came to a horrifying halt. That day Norr
told her hypnotherapist that Petrossi attacked her on the staircase inside
her apartment, dragged her to a couch, removed her clothes and raped her.
The hypnotherapist, Ron Palmer, notified authorities, and Petrossi was
jailed the next day.
The case went to trial three months later. Petrossi was represented by
Craig Bainum, a 35-year-old public defender. Bainum, now in private
practice, acknowledges he made some mistakes.
``One of the decisions I made that I ended up regretting is that I
didn't want to go after her too hard,'' Bainum said. ``She was real
sympathetic. She was just a tiny, soft-spoken, sweet little thing, and I'm a
big guy. I just can't imagine how hard I could have gone after her.''
But Bainum admits he also didn't do an extensive background check on
Norr. His request for police records only went back to 1995, and he never
contacted her family members, specifically her father, Randall Johnson, who
would later prove to be the key to Petrossi's freedom.
``I don't know why I didn't [talk to her family members],'' Bainum said.
``I would probably have to say that I felt we had such a strong case that I
just didn't see how he could get convicted.''
Indeed, prosecutors had no physical evidence. Norr would not submit to a
rape examination. No semen samples were ever taken nor found at the alleged
crime scene. And there were no incriminating bruises or scratches. The only
sign of trauma Norr showed was a dislocated shoulder, but witnesses
testified that her shoulder appeared fine the morning after the alleged
attack.
The jury didn't have much more to go on than Norr's word and testimony
from her hypnotherapist. That was enough. Just after midnight on June 18,
1996, the panel of two men and six women came in with a guilty verdict.
Petrossi nearly fainted; Bainum put an arm around him to support him. In
the gallery, Jana Petrossi cried silently.
``I thought, `My God, why me,' '' Ted Petrossi recalled. As they
escorted him out, he waved the sign-language symbol of `I love you' to his
wife: thumb, forefinger and pinkie extended.
``That was all I could think to do,'' he said.
Petrossi was sentenced in September 1996. He had already spent the
previous six months in Utah County Jail, reading the Book of Mormon and spy
novels and playing pinochle and solitaire. Now he was on his way to Utah
State Prison in Draper.
At 5-foot-6, 145 pounds, Petrossi did not cut the figure of an ex-
Marine. He was genial, soft-voiced and wore thick, nerdish glasses with
square frames. The thought of prison frightened him. But as a jail guard in
the military, he knew how to conduct himself as an inmate.
``Prison life, as it is, you make friends there, you just can't alienate
yourself,'' he said.
Meantime, Bainum left the public defender's office but, working out of
his basement for free, continued to pursue Petrossi's appeal. The big break
came just a month after his sentencing when Norr accused yet another man,
Jana Petrossi's brother, of raping her. The circumstances were almost
identical: no physical evidence, just a dislocated shoulder.
But the man had an airtight alibi, and this time Orem police proved
beyond doubt that Norr was lying. She was charged for making a false
accusation.
Bainum filed for a new trial for Petrossi. But he could no longer work
the case. It went to Randy Spencer, a new face in the public defender's
office who had been out of law school less than two years. ``I'd never had a
case like this,'' the 31-year-old attorney said.
Spencer knew one false accusation wouldn't be enough, so he began
digging into Norr's past. He subpoenaed her mental health records and
learned that she had made accusations against her father. Spencer found her
father living in Sandy.
``Her father was really the gold mine,'' Spencer said.
Norr had accused her father of abusing her in satanic rituals, and later
admitted to lying. Over the next seven months, Spencer would learn that Norr
had accused at least five other people of raping or abusing her, including
her stepfather, husband, former boyfriend and a woman. Doctors had diagnosed
her with borderline personality disorder, and said she had a penchant for
faking illnesses and lying to attract attention.
In one case in 1987, a California man was charged with raping her in an
Orem motel room. But the deputy prosecutor at the time, Kay Bryson, dropped
the charges once he learned of her past and discovered that the Division of
Child and Family Services had found she was lying in cases involving her
father and stepfather.
``I talked to a number of invidividuals . . . all of whom led me to
believe she was not truthful,'' Bryson recalled.
So where was Bryson and all this information during Petrossi's first
trial?
The prosecutor in the case, Phillip Hadfield, said most of it was buried
in storage. Bryson, who now runs the county attorneys office, said he wasn't
involved in the Petrossi case, and seldom consults with his staff on routine
cases. Norr's name didn't ring a bell with him in any case, he said, because
in 1987 she was 15 years old and going by her maiden name of Johnson.
Finally, Bryson said case records in 1987 were only indexed by defendants'
names, not victims', so finding her file in the archives would have been
nearly impossible.
On Dec. 5, 1997, a judge granted a motion for a new trial. The same
judge would later dismiss the charges and expunge Petrossi's record.
Spencer delivered the news to his client in prison: ``I remember it was
a cold night and I had to get special permission to see him after hours, and
he gave me a hug and cried and said, `God bless you.' It was a real touching
moment.''
Petrossi was free. Jana Petrossi told her children she had a surprise
Christmas present for them, then brought Ted home.
``They didn't recognize me at first,'' Petrossi recalled. ``Then they
shreiked, and hugged me and kissed me.''
Ted and Jana Petrossi remarried in March, a small Mormon wedding
performed by their bishop. Jana wore a lavender dress and a wreath of
flowers and ribbons made by a neighbor.
Ted wore a new olive-green suit; his teen-age son was his best man. Ted
Petrossi returned to work at McDonald's and the family is trying to recover
from the financial turmoil created during the 21 months Ted was without an
income.
It was a few days after he was released that everything came surging at
him all at once: ``I was sitting in church and I had all my family around
me, and the choir was singing, and it was so beautiful I just started
crying, and I cried through the whole next hour.''
He thought to himself, ``You are free, you are home, you are with your
family, you are where you wanted to be 21 months ago.''
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