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I'm posting this for Thomas since we're currently inundated with news stories and I don't want to post too many at this time:
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I think this may be important enough to be presented as a separate news story. If not, Scott, please let me know and I'll post it as a comment to one of the other articles on Bob Rowan and the ceramic penises. If the demonstration takes place, it could be wonderful for the egalitarian movement.
Here's the story:
I just met Bob Rowan at a small demonstration at the Boulder Public Library. I still feel that it may have been best to leave the display up, since it was such a clear and dramatic demonstration of anti-male hatred and, as such, it was turning people against that hate. Nevertheless, I have to say that the man impressed me. His intentions were good when he took the ceramic penises, and this situation may still turn out well.
During the demonstration, we stood at the side of Canyon Boulevard, one of Boulder's main thoroughfares, waving flags and holding fists in the air. Out of many hundreds of people who passed by, two-thirds to three-quarters waved, flashed their lights, gave us thumbs up or raised supportive fists in the air. Only three people, that I saw, gave signs of objection. Nearly as many women as men showed their approval.
I suggested to Bob that he speak with Lewis and Floorwax, two very popular radio personalities on 103.5 FM, and ask them to help organize a demonstration at the BPL. Since Bob's in touch with them every morning these days, this might work out. Bob wants to do it this Saturday. (It's supposed to be sunny with highs in the low- to mid-60s.) Another radio station may also announce the demonstration, if it is going to take place.
We may try to get people from military bases to come, if possible in uniform. Also, it would be great for people to come from other places and in some way show that they came from afar for the event. I'll let you all know.
Bob said that he will definitely come to the chat tonight, as will I. See you then. Let's hope that this can be a true flash point for the egalitarian movement.
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Nice work, Thomas. Unfortunately, I will be working this Saturday (can't get out of it because I'm integral to the project). :( I wish you well, though.
You know, I'd REALLY like to know what the ACTUAL name of the artwork was supposed to be. The media in Boulder keep changing it. It has been:
"Hung out to dry"
"Hanging 'em out to dry"
"Hanging them out to dry"
"Hang 'em out to dry"
At least they were consistent on the "out to dry" part.
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This was a post on the Men's Media Network concerning the original story of the penis mutilation display:
"Being a Colorado resident (located a 'safe' 70 miles south of Boulder) this doesn't really surprise me. Boulder is more or less the joke (and embarrassement) of Colorado. People here joke constantly about simply building a wall around the area (to contain). There seems to be a concentration of people like this librarian there. This city, in which special city council permission had to be granted before an actor could smoke on stage as part of a character because smoking in public in Boulder is illegal and where people who have cats and dogs are known as pet caretakers and not pet owners has quite the reputation among Coloradans. What this library did was not looked at kindly by most. Its caught a lot of unwanted public attention and has certainly caught the attention of the states republican governor.
Terry"
Ah, the governor! Perhaps the only person left in Colorado left whom I hadn't contacted with a complaint. I'll soon fix that.
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I do feel the need to explain further why Bob Rowan didn't show up tonight...I have a bit of responsibility in the matter.
When Bob e-mailed me to confirm the chat session, he had said in his e-mail that it was Thursday from 9:30 PM EST, and I didn't notice that he said Thursday, not Wed. He has said he will come to next week's chat, and I apologize for the mix-up.
Scott
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gee bro, and ya got nothing else ta do...
i wasn't expecting much in the way of revelation from our hero, anyway
by now he's probably blinded by the bright camera lights
the chat thing is a fine tool, and i much appreciate the work you do running it and the site, but the discussions are so unfocused -- chocolate penises and such -- more like being in a bar than an activist group
soon as i said something controversial, folks fled
good for emotional support, i guess, but not very productive
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Hi Remarksman,
Tonight's chat was a bit of an aberration. Generally the way they go is like this:
- The first half hour is spent with everyone getting their act together, with greetings as people join in and introductory banter.
- The next hour or so is generally focused pretty well on the actual chat topic, with people contributing ideas and opinions fairly consistently.
- After that, things tend to dissolve into tangents or completely different topics, and people slowly disappear.
I'm not saying there's anything bad about this...it's just the way things go when you have a dozen or more people having at least as many conversations at once. "Controlled chaos" is the term I'd use to describe the focused part of the chat, and "complete chaos" is what I'd describe it with the rest of the time. :)
Since we were expecting Rowan, I didn't do much to keep the group focused on the topic, and then when I heard that he wasn't going to make it, I figured I'd just let people chat about whatever they wanted - esp. considering there were several newcomers to tonight's chat.
The "chocolate penis" discussion wasn't exactly the high point of the chat for me, either, but I figured, what the hell. :)
Take care,
Scott
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I must've left to sweat off my fever before you said your controversial piece. I remember you being there, but I don't remember you saying anything. What was so controversial? (Just curious)
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From Rocky Mountain News again. This story contains my all time favorite quote among everything I've read about this case so far:
[The so-called artist] Walker, in her statement, demanded the thief confront her personally. "If you want to attack me or my artwork, then confront me with discussion," she wrote.
"There is no face-to-face discussion," Rowan said. "I'd be glad to stare at her, but we won't have a conversation on what the value of her art is. Not in our public library, anyway. You don't hang penises and then discuss what the value is."
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hope your fever broke and you're feeling better
i don't have audio for a replay, but at some point a man from tennessee, named something like do-good, entered and wrote about his work at court-appointed group "counseling" meetings for "batterers" -- for males only, apparently -- the rare female perp receives individual "therapy"
basically, it's yet another state-sponsored stomping session designed by the neo-matriarchate and its drones to "re-educate" men about their abusive, testosterone-enraged oppression of females
it was one of the few interesting threads -- he told how the experience was revelatory for him -- he now understood there was another side to the perp(male)- victim(female)story
i asked some questions, like was he paid, etc. -- he said the program was run by femifascists (yow, huge surprise), he was paid forty bucks a week (i think)and he felt that he was helping men there by being the only sympathetic ear
my opinion was that he was merely feeding the machine (profiting by the scapegoating and suffering of his brothers, though i didn't say that)
he said something about forty bucks being nothing and poof, he was gone
(i dunno, i live on less than that a week)
the chat was interesting, and scott above explained to me it was anomalous, but i had an educational experience after logging off, if you'll bear with me
i checked my brother's e-mail (shared), and it contained an invitation from the local chapter of the american association of university women to attend a local fundraiser this friday -- complete with food, drinks and live music
the aauw is one of the most powerful, regressive organizations of hatemongers around -- they share much culpability for turning our universities into ideological concentration camps in the past thirty years
the town i live in isn't hardly big enough to spit on -- and yet the aauw has an extremely well-organized, entrenched, profitable chapter here
the ladies are all smiles and how-ya-dos in the grocery store -- unless of course yer not on "their side," in which case your status, reputation, and prospects immediately falls below dogshit
males in a small town like this wouldn't buck them
for a fresh stand of old-growth timber, even if they knew the aauw's agendas, which they do not
i couldn't help but contrast that to the ineffectual chat i'd just experienced ... occasionally someone would introduce a productive thread, like the need for a national mens' organization, but it got drowned in the chatter --like the wiccan diverting us into discussions about chocolate penises
the juxtaposition was enlightening -- one tiny town in the woods of washington harbors a more effective organization for women than any mens' organization in the entire nation
the wonder is not that we're second-class citizens, the wonder is that we're allowed citizenship at all
the fems are absolutely right -- we truly do not "get it," and until we do, the aauw and its cysters will dominate us collectively, from birth to grave
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by Anonymous User on Thursday November 15, @01:04PM EST (#11)
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On what grounds can we bring a countersuit
against the library?
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For the benefit of those who were not at the chat last night, I'd like to let everyone know that that "chocolate penis" bit was my fault. There were two women in the chatroom last night, one of them an artist and both of them mothers of sons. Prior to remarksman's arrival in the chatroom (I think), one of those ladies mentioned that she thought what the Boulder artist did with the ceramic penises was "awful," and in the same sentence mentioned that she thinks penises are "beautiful."
I was intrigued by her comments because most women I know think penises are ugly. So, I wanted to pick this woman's brain a bit and find out more about her and why she thinks the way she does about that portion of the male anatomy. I found it relevant to the discussion because I believe women who would severe men's penises would do so because they think of it as an "ugly" or "dirty" member of the male anatomy. Face it, our penises have been give a bad reputation by feminists as a symbol of oppression, war, and rape.
It is also my opinion that female voices in opposition of that Boulder aberration are just as important as the male voices in opposition of it, so I wanted to encourage our female chatters to keep talking and voicing their own opinions, no matter whether they completely agreed with the majority of males in the room.
Predictably, the discussion of "beautiful penises" turned somewhat into sexual banter between the lady, myself, and a few others in the chatroom. By this time, of course, we all knew that Rowan wasn't going to show and the ceramic penis issue had been discussed at length (no pun intended) both in the chat room AND on this site.
Also, I should point out that there were SEVERAL threads of discussion going on at the same time as the aforementioned "chocolate penis" bit (which I think comprised all of two or three sentences out of the entire chat), so it wasn't like the entire chat session turned into sexual banter between those few folks who were on bonessa's thread.
These chats have been conducted via MANN for several months now, and I think every single one of them has been its own raging success in some way or other. Likewise, most of them HAVE been controversial in some way or another. No one agrees on everything, and no one has ever run screaming from the chat because someone said something with which someone else disagreed (some have left simply because they didn't want to talk about it, but that's altogether different). In fact, many chat nights you'll find the rest of us trying to hold Acksiom back while he argues with a feminist who popped in to troll.
Finally, you will very often find bits of levity interjected into these chat conversations, especially among the folks who are regulars. I think that's just as important as the serious discussions that take place in the chat room. My personal opinion is that if we remain humorless, then the chats lose some of their fun side, fewer people will be willing to actively participate in the discussions, and we'll end up leaving their feeling depressed and alone.
Anyway, I just wanted to point out these things for those folks who may be reading this thread and may have been turned off by the description of last night's chat. Voices are not censored unless they become so overwhelmingly antagonistic that no one else can speak, and all opinions are encouraged.
Thanks for letting me rant. :)
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p.s. No offense is intended to remarksman by my above post. I fully understand his concerns about last night's chat, and I do hope he returns next week.
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no offense taken whatsoever, mist
i wasn't trying to pick on you (you'd know if i were), and i only used the chocopenis example cause it stuck in me noggin
(handbacked compliment)
i'm a newbie to the room, so my opinion here isn't well-informed, as scott demonstrated
i agree that the deal oughta be fun as well as productive
i've seen a lot of nasty shit go down over gender in the past three decades, and the innocent are still gettin massacred -- no doubt i often get too intense and too reactive -- i am not patient or politesse when it comes to folks whuppin on the defenseless
my intention was not to belabor any particular comment, but to contrast, broadly, the effectiveness of activism on womens' agendas with a men's movement that, to me, lacks passion, organization, dedication, and the willingness to make necessary sacrifices
i admire, by the way, how you and others welcome folks to the room, and attend their departure
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