Is It Hiring Discrimination to Ask About Having Babies?

Submitted by Roy on Mon, 2008-02-11 16:23

This piece offers pro/con views about whether employers should be able to consider a woman's plans to have babies when hiring her:

(Pro) - "From a position of no equality at all, women are now granted absolute privilege. ... because an employer is forbidden from asking if a woman plans to have children, experience tells them she'll sign up then rush off and start a family, brandishing her contract as a declaration of human rights."

(Con) - "Women have different skill sets from men, not least the ability to multi-task - a skill which defeats most men. If we weren't such good multi-taskers, the human race would not have survived. A woman should be given a job on ability... nothing else matters."

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Ed. note: Before our North American readers post that "the article is dated Nov. 2, 2008, how can that be?" remember that date formats in most non-North American publications are "day-month-year" instead of "month-day-year".

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Comments

even though it would be a good idea if you did.
i know we hired a talented woman expecting good service, and 3 weeks later she announced she was pregnant. we didn't get nearly what we had planned for her particular position, and it required that we then go hire someone else in addition to her. it was a ripoff for the entire business. but what can you do?

oregon dad

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Submitted by oregon dad on Mon, 2008-02-11 17:23

I'd be with the "Con" side of the debate, at least in terms of outcomes, not ideology, if men were given paternity leave without penalty and without grudge.

Imagine a business world where men, shortly after hire, took off 6 months (or whatever) for paternity leave whether or not it was convenient for the boss, and had legal resources available almost for free to assert his right to do that, then be able to use that as a basis for legal action/threatened legal action if he didn't get whatever he wanted in terms of seniority of position or promotion opportunities at damn near any time in the future?

Imagine such a world. Imagine.

Wouldn't it be great?

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Submitted by mcc99 on Mon, 2008-02-11 17:51

It is good to see someone else shed light on how things would look if "men" were getting the preferential treatment women have been receiving since way back when. Many men fail to do the "what if the shoe was on the other foot" test which would factually reveal just how many privileges women are handed in this society.

Society would never afford men the privileges women receive.

Anyone that looks at all of the privileges women have and whom still has the gall to moan that "this is not a zerom sum game", claim that "men control everything", that "women are still oppressed" or any such other pro-female ideology needs to have his or her head checked.

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Mr. Reality's new story - Sir Alan: Why I have to think twice before employing a woman

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Submitted by MrReality on Mon, 2008-02-11 19:27

I guess that's why most air traffic controllers and jet fighter pilots are women, eh?
The "multi-tasking" issue is simplistic, pseudo-scientific nonsense.

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Submitted by n.j. on Mon, 2008-02-11 21:18

...the ability to demand strict equality yet whine for preferential treatment for women at the same time.

As a matter of fact most women whine about not being able to be mothers, find a "good man" and hold down a job at the same time. Multi-tasking my ***.

It's easy to claim that you do everything if noone ever demands anything of you, you're not held to the same standards as everyone else and everyone hands you everything for a lower price if not for free.

How am I actually "working" therefore "multi-tasking" if I get job positions due to my gender, get time off to have babies due to my gender, get free government money due to my gender, get politically correct shielding due to my gender, win cases due to my gender, get free meals and jewelry due to my gender, get less jailtime -- if any -- due to my gender, etc, etc?

That's not multi-tasking that's everyone doing things for me and me taking the glory. Remember most -- not all -- women want the glory of high positions and glorious claims without the responsibility(or experience) that comes along with them. For the most part women like to be "seen" in powerful positions by society that doesn't mean they actually "work for them" or had the required experience(whether real-life or degree) to get said positions. There are tons of times -- throughout history and nowadays -- that women took credit for what a man did; The Ada myth comes to mind.

Most women don't multi-task they multi-steal from others who were actually DOING the tasks then they(i.e. Most Women) multi-congratulate themselves for doing nothing.

I guess a baby is "multi-tasking" when it feeds and goes to the bathroom on itself at the same time? Sadly, babies tend to be much more productive -- and better "multi-taskers" -- than most women.

NOTE: Mr. Reality was "multi-tasking" while typing this; he was breathing while typing.

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Mr. Reality's new story - Sir Alan: Why I have to think twice before employing a woman

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Submitted by MrReality on Mon, 2008-02-11 21:52

n.p. - Thanks for pointing out the "multi-tasking" ridiculous myth that women have been proclaiming for three decades.

I think it all comes from being able to breast feed, smoke, and talk on the phone all at the same time. (All highly evolved and intellectually taxing behaviors...)

How about the activity of hunting? (Recall that human beings would have died out 40,000 years ago if men could not coordinate sophisticated strategies to kill large, fast animals. Women back in the cave probably said "the men are out shopping for tonight's dinner...)

The worst executives I have worked for have all been women. They were so busy "multi-tasking" that they behaved like children with ADHD -- perpetually distracted and incapable of focus.

Of course, that's my male bias showing...

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Submitted by Roy on Mon, 2008-02-11 22:37

Matt,

You've done a great service to explain the way that the majority of the world writes out dates as DAY - MONTH - YEAR.

I schooled in Europe and picked this up and it just makes more sense... It's the same format in Latin America and most of Asia.

Cheers.

11 February 2008.

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Submitted by Roy on Mon, 2008-02-11 23:10

MrReality, you were "multi-tasking" when you woke up this morning.

This is a really great and funny post!

"Most women don't multi-task they multi-steal from others who were actually DOING the tasks then they(i.e. Most Women) multi-congratulate themselves for doing nothing."

Brilliant.

I think there are some about to be re-hired Hollywood writers you might wish to correspond with because your material is outstanding.

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Submitted by Roy on Mon, 2008-02-11 23:30

If they are such great multi-taskers (so much that society wouldn't exist without it), why do they need time off to take care of a baby? Oh that's right, it's multi-tasking.

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Submitted by blaze4metal on Mon, 2008-02-11 23:41

You guys all make a good point. Here's my stance on this issue. If an employer were to ask a man about his plans for starting a family, would anybody care? No. So why should they care when an employer asks a woman the same question? It's relevant. The employer wants to know how the employee plans to balance their home and work life. There isn't a single ounce of disrimination involved in this.

Although, the allegation that men are not as good at multi-tasking is disriminatory and nothing more than BS. After all, how could we put up with denigrating advertisements, articles, and movies all at once? I rest my case.

Evan AKA X-TRNL
Real Men Don't Take Abuse!

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Submitted by xtrnl on Tue, 2008-02-12 00:37

Although, the allegation that men are not as good at multi-tasking is disriminatory and nothing more than BS.

In order for there to be an allegation that men are not "as good at multi-tasking", women would first have to actually be good at it which of course entails real work. Automatically 99% of women fail the test. Therefore since I've already debunked the "multi-tasking fiction" there is really no need to make a comparison because men have nothing to compare to. Get it?

Alright let's move on gentlemen..

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Mr. Reality's new story - Sir Alan: Why I have to think twice before employing a woman

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Submitted by MrReality on Tue, 2008-02-12 17:13