[an error occurred while processing this directive]
Do We Need a Men's Rights Movement?
posted by Thomas on 02:57 PM April 1st, 2004
The Media The Christian Science Monitor is having a poll on whether or not there should be a men's rights movement.

Unfortunately, they missed the boat by having as the only two options, "No. Men still enjoy a privileged position," and "Yes. Casual male-bashing has become too commonplace." Casual male-bashing is hardly the only anti-male discrimination in a society, where men and boys are disappearing from the educational system; male suicide is rampant; far more money is put into researching female-specific diseases than male-specific diseases; for a given crime men receive far more severe sentences than women; paternity fraud is pandemic; men are railroaded in divorce and child custody determinations; domestic violence by women against men is either ignored or excused as self-defense; men account for 94% of workplace fatalities, and there is a federal Office of Women's Health but no federal Office of Men's Health, despite the fact that on average women outlive men by the better part of a decade — to name a few items.

If you'd like, you can vote here. When I last checked, the poll was running 81% in favor of a men's movement.

25 Greatest Getaways for Men by MSN | IWF dismisses men's concerns  >

  
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.
they don't get it (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 06:52 PM April 1st, 2004 EST (#1)

As you correctly point out, the poll itself is evidence of the ignorance about men's lives.
Re: Loved the Fembot Quote (Score:1)
by Roy on 08:01 PM April 1st, 2004 EST (#3)
(User #1393 Info)
The poll was a sub-section of the Christian Science Monitor's piece covering NOW's objections to Glenn Sack's "Boys Are Stupid" tee-shirt campaign.

Full article at -

http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0331/p16s01-lihc.htm l

I really enjoyed this disingenuous comment from Helen Grieco, executive director of the National Organization for Women (NOW), California chapter:

"Men certainly suffer their own oppressions and should fight for their rights," she says. "I would offer nothing but applause for a legitimate voice fighting for men, while respecting women."

Let's see -- that would be the "voices" of a full choir of eunuchs singing the NOW pledge song?

Once again, a crystal clear illumination of how the feminists reserve for themselves the right to declare and decide the "legtimacy" of men's voices!

Lady... we've got a big "illegitimate" surprise coming your way real soon!

And, forgive me, but I'm already convinced you will "offer nothing..."


"It's a terrible thing ... living in fear." - Roy: hunted replicant, Blade Runner
Ms Harman is Christian Male Hater (IMHO) (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 08:58 PM April 1st, 2004 EST (#4)
After reading the following quote from Glenn and Ms Harman who obviously hates Glenn, I wrote a letter to the editor:

Glenn observes, "If, in the first week of college orientation, 'they' hand out pamphlets about rape on college campuses and it says 1 out of 4 will be raped, blah blah blah," he argues, "bang! Eighteen-year-old guys, right from the beginning, are stigmatized, vilified, lied about."

Ms Harman spews the hate line, "(A March 2002 US Department of Justice report, however, estimates that 25 percent of college women have been victims of rape since the age of 14.)"


Well that was enough for me. I looked up the origional study and quoted from it. Ms. Harman and most all of the other feminist Christians are too stupid to believe the truth. You can read the truth and actual conclusions of the study that Ms. Harman in my opinion lies about here:

Real Rape Rates below 1.5%!!!!

I made a few points like the 56% decline in the rape of women between 1993 and 2002. I also pointed out that the study has no such lie that Ms Harman tells. There is no 1 in 4 woman will be raped statistic in the study she cites.

What is really sick is that it is actually men that are suffering all of the violence. Yet Ms. Harman is too hateful to have compassion on the male gender because the Christian community has bought into the feminist agenda of hate.

Here is Wendy's well explained article on how feminist profs spread their hate stats:

Mother of All Myths

(Explains how the 1 in 4 rape lie was manufactured by feminists and names the person responsible for starting this form of male-hate.)

Warble

Re:Ms Harman is Christian Male Hater (IMHO) (Score:2)
by Thomas on 09:32 PM April 1st, 2004 EST (#5)
(User #280 Info)
Real Rape Rates below 1.5%!!!!

Maybe I'm misreading something here, but the graph seems to indicate that 0.75 women per 1000 over the age of 12 are raped. That would be 0.075% or one-twentieth of what you state. In addition, the statistic is for both rapes and attempted (but, apparently, uncompleted) rapes. Even if as many as half of attempted rapes were ultimately perpetrated, that would make the rate of rapes 0.0375% or one-fortieth of 1.5%.

Thomas
-- Creating hostile environments for feminazis since the 1970s.

Re:Ms Harman is Christian Male Hater (IMHO) (Score:2)
by Thomas on 09:36 PM April 1st, 2004 EST (#6)
(User #280 Info)
Even if as many as half of attempted rapes were ultimately perpetrated, that would make the rate of rapes 0.0375% or one-fortieth of 1.5%.

This is less than one-five hundredth of the rate claimed by Harman.

Thomas
-- Creating hostile environments for feminazis since the 1970s.

Re:Ms Harman is Christian Male Hater (IMHO) (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 02:16 PM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#18)
Exactly. They lie! And yes I was misreading the graph. The rape rates are much lower than 1%.

Warble
my letter to CSM regarding the article (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 11:31 PM April 1st, 2004 EST (#9)
My letter to CSM:

I grew up an avid reader of the Christian Science Monitor. I was very active within the youth group in my parish before beginning my undergraduate studies at a small Catholic college and then attending a Jesuit school for graduate studies.

With that said, I find it questionable that a publication that I expect to be grounded in the ideals of Christianity, would allow an article (“Bashing boys is, like, not OK” by Danna Harman 3/31/04) that came across as though it is mocking half the population and the diligent efforts of Glenn Sacks.

The introduction of the article was a bit informative for the readers not familiar with the situation. However, deeper into the article, Danna, in my opinion, appeared to counter the quotes from Mr. Sacks with unproven and sensationalized remarks from the NOW (National Organization for Women).

Danna also incorrectly countered the argument that Mr. Sacks’ made regarding the myth that 1 in 4 college women will be raped. First, she responded by comparing apples to oranges. Furthermore, this mythological number of 1 in 4 has been regularly discredited by a number of studies and academics, including Wendy McElroy of Fox News and the Independent Women’s Forum.

Finally, Dana indicated that “Sacks is working to transform his 15 minutes of fame into a soapbox”. Come on, Danna. If you actually researched your article(s), you would know that Mr. Sacks is well covered and involved in the mainstream media, which is quite a feat considering the taboo topics of men’s (and boy’s) issues that he addresses.

To me, the article vilified men and boys. If that is the culture that the Christian Science Monitor approves of, sadly, I will not be a reader of the Monitor until men and boys are treated equally and with respect.

Christian Male Hater is an oxymoron (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 12:29 PM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#13)
Ms Harman is Christian Male Hater (IMHO)

That's an oxymoron. Neither Ms. Harmon, or you, or me can define what a Christian is, the Bible does.

I Corinthians says, "If you have not love you are nothing." Do not pass go. Do not go to 2nd base. Do not role the dice again. Game over.

In a nutshell, according to Christianity, existence without love is nihilism in the extreme.
O.K., if this is not a pattern (just a slip up) she may still be a Christian, but if this is her consistent belief I would say to her, "You're a Christian? I'm from Missouri, 'Show Me.'" Heavan could be a really small place.

I will not argue with the contention that Ms. Harman appears to be a Man-Hater.

Ray

Re:Christian Male Hater is an oxymoron (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 02:19 PM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#19)
You got it Ray. Ms Harman is in my opinion a devil incarnate because of her lies about rape. She cannot possibly be a Christian.

But if she will admit she is wrong and publically apologize for her lies I'll accept that.

Warble
Re:Christian Male Hater is an oxymoron (Score:1)
by MAUS on 06:48 PM April 4th, 2004 EST (#29)
(User #1582 Info)
The reason why I stopped my studies to become a minister and ultimately why I stopped attending church was because of the way they welcomed feminazis with open arms.

At the Divinity School I was accepted at I saw a contingent from the feminazi headquarters undergrad school I attended arriving and I tried to warn the powers that be of what they were in for. I was told I was from a bygone era and if I could not adapt to the change should reconsider ministry. A matter of months later the head of the school committed suicide in the wake of the sexual misconduct witch hunt they orchestrated, and not because he was accused of any hanky panky but because he questioned the fairness and objectivity of the accusations raised against others.

The church and the feminazis have formed an unholy alliance because anyone who claims that sex degrades women and offends God can't be all bad.
Re:Christian Male Hater is an oxymoron (Score:1)
by BreaK on 04:15 PM April 7th, 2004 EST (#41)
(User #1474 Info)
First of all, i have been educated in the Jesuites, in my country being catholic was mandatory till 30 year ago, still religion, catholic religion, is mandatory in the schools, now some questions:

Are christian the judges that steal children from their fathers? are christians the legislators that pass laws to allow women to steal children from men? are christians the politicians that allow women to have children by their own resulting in thousands of men doomed to die childless, while forced to to support those "choices" via taxation? :

Most of them if not all of them.

Now compare this with the situation of men in muslim countries, crystal clear, christianity has completly degenarated into a feminist religion, no doubt why there less ans less men attending church, no doubt why the only religion that is growing is the islam, no doubt why western societies where men has no reason to have children and where children are used as a pretext to exploit men, steal their hard earn money and their assets, (what is left of them after the feminist State taxation) are fadding away while islamic societies are prolific.

I wonder if all this is not just a waste of time, may be we must do nothing the west will die out and with it the feminists, may be we should just have fun and in case of wanting children go and start a familie in any of the many muslim soceties that exist in the world.

PD: No wonder why the see us as degenerated, men in christian countires are just scum.
Re:Christian Male Hater is an oxymoron (Score:1)
by BreaK on 04:28 PM April 7th, 2004 EST (#42)
(User #1474 Info)
FORGOT TO TELL:

Each time i see goverments passing new laws to degrade men even further, each time i see how things get worst for men, and aboveall each time i see men supporting their own explotation or the explotation of their brothers, fathers and sons, i become convinced that feninist will never be defeated and that WAS depreesing, not any more, i really find comfort on the knowledge that the awhole west is bound to die out and with it the feminazies and their male minions.
Re:Christian Male Hater is an oxymoron (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 03:36 PM April 8th, 2004 EST (#43)
i really find comfort on the knowledge that the awhole west is bound to die out and with it the feminazies and their male minions.

Sounds like the Muslams are only to happe to hep us widt da gubment and its decline.....

Ya. I can see why the terrorists would think American is weak....

Warble

Ms Harman is a gender feminist Male Hater (IMHO) (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 01:01 PM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#14)
"What is really sick is that it is actually men that are suffering all of the violence. Yet Ms. Harman is too hateful to have compassion on the male gender because the Christian community has bought into the feminist agenda of hate."

Many pastors believe they should acquiesce to "Caesar" (Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar and unto God the things that are God), but unwittingly they are rendering unto the evil forces of gender feminism instead (which has permeated law, government, and subsequently, their churches).

Is grace and excuse for an acquiescence to evil? Absolutely not! I am reminded of two images from the WWII era, one is of Hitler walking out of a church with the church door behind him. A cross is perfectly centered above his head as if he were divine. Secondly, certain 2 & 5 reich marc coins have the Pottsdam Garrison Church stamped on them with the big cross on top of the church. On either side of the church steeple/cross is a Swastika. Christians should be far more careful what they let walk through their doors these days. I can tell you from experience that there are some good pastors who are aware of a lot of the gender feminist evils that are inherent in government and law these days, but I can also tell you that there are some real idiots in the pulpit in this regard as well. Let the buyer beware certainly applies to churches when it comes to the evil gender feminist influences present in Christian churches.

If Jesus were in his physical form on earth today, I have no doubts (none) He would make the scourging of the money changers in the temple look like a picnic compared to his reaction to gender feminist ideology in the church. Those money changers were choir boys compared to the gender feminist hate monger bigots who have brought their man hating domestic violence propaganda and other man hating programs into the church.

If that sounds a little unloving to some just think what your reaction would be if some visitor to your home left some vile smelly insult in response to good will and love you showed them.

Re:Ms Harman is a gender feminist Male Hater (IMHO (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 01:31 PM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#15)
Even Pat Robertson denies that DV happens to men.
Some years ago I was listening to him and he was talking about violence in the media or something like that.
His exact words were; "When you see the wife sock the man in the chin..., That doesn't REALLY happen..."
Again, his EXACT words.

  Thundercloud.
  "Hoka hey!"
Re:Ms Harman is a gender feminist Male Hater (IMHO (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 01:56 PM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#17)
"When you see the wife sock the man in the chin..., That doesn't REALLY happen..."
Again, his EXACT words."


Pat Robertson has been known to discredit himself by talking about things he knows nothing about as that quote clearly indicates. Depending on your politics, D. James Kennedy is far more scholarly. I saw him agains last night on Scarborough Country.

However, it pains me to say that many Christians are completely foolish in their beliefs, when it comes to knowing the truth about female perpetrators of domestic violence or gender feminisms attacks on Christianity.

Ray


Re:Ms Harman is a gender feminist Male Hater (IMHO (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 02:22 PM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#20)
Many pastors believe they should acquiesce to "Caesar" (Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar and unto God the things that are God), but unwittingly they are rendering unto the evil forces of gender feminism instead (which has permeated law, government, and subsequently, their churches).

Exactly. God never said runder unto Ceasar complete and absolute control of your thoughts, belief in family, and love of God. Yet evil feminist Pastors do this on a routine basis and lead the masses into the deamons waiting to devour them.

Warble
Re:Ms Harman is a gender feminist Male Hater (IMHO (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 03:09 PM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#21)
I don't know that much scripture but doesn't it say somewhere in the Bible that in the 'end times' the devil will infiltrate even the church?

If so, it sounds like the devil HAS infiltrated the churh already, and he (she?) is in the guise of feminism.

  Thundercloud.
  "Hoka hey!"
Re:Ms Harman is a gender feminist Male Hater (IMHO (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 06:58 PM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#24)
"I don't know that much scripture but doesn't it say somewhere in the Bible that in the 'end times' the devil will infiltrate even the church?"

Yes, and more. It says that evil is highly deceptive and masks itself in the shades of grey between what is clearly right and clearly wrong, between what is clearly good and clearly evil. There is a verse encouraging to be as wise as a serpent, but as innocent as a dove. Certainly, that last sentence is recommended reading for anyone having any dealings with gender feminists.

Ray

Re:Ms Harman is a gender feminist Male Hater (IMHO (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 08:36 PM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#26)
The bottom line is that hating men is NOT being Christian. And yes, there are a lot of male haters who try to pretend that they're Christian. Their anti-male hate reveals what they really are.
time tells and now it is our time (Score:1)
by Betrayed in America on 07:46 PM April 1st, 2004 EST (#2)
(User #1381 Info)
Well I replied. . .did you?

Personally I think its sad that a gender or racial "movement" is ever necessary. Unfortunatly we live the real world. The Constitution of the United States was carefully written but not enforced. Thus "movements" aimed to change attitudes and policies. Obviously this is a gender forum so I will stay focused on that.

Words are powerfull and very suggestive for instance lets look a the words used in this very vote:

No. Men still enjoy a privileged position.

Powerfully suggesting that men are privileged. First off I as an average American White 39 year old male, would surley love to find out what privileges I am supposed to be enjoying and/or ever had. Certainly not jobs. . . as I personally have been denied the best jobs I ever came close to getting (and qualified, not to mention chosen for) simply because I am a white male. . . just one personal example, General Motors, Hamtramic plant, Michigan, passed both test, was chosen with two others out of about 50 for the orientation, had experience but was told that because I was not a female (or minority) they couldn't hire me. How about family and the promoted divorce of said. Do I have some sort of power and /or privilege that maybe I've just missed. Don't think so, just the way it is and has been for more then my time. How about education. . .nope, no privilages there either actually the oppisite. And health. . .not a chance at any preference or privilege. All my statements are factual and I can and will provide proof if anyone cares. It is all available through gov. stats, hosp stats, educational stats but definately not through feminist stats.

Yes. Casual male-bashing has become too commonplace.

Surley suggesting that the mens "movement" is centered around CASUAL MALE_BASHING. What a farse! There are so many serious male "issues" that I won't even begin to list them here. These issues are un-arguable and will not go away. Society will deal with the truth either now or later but the longer it goes on. . .the bigger the list grows and more women and men will absolutly suffer. Gotta love the word "casual" don't ya, very belittling isn't it?

As the inequities of some males have been cast upon all males over the past 50 years, so are the inequities females beginning to be cast upon all females. . .but just beginning.

As I live in fear for my son. . .I feel soon, I'll also live in fear for my daughters.

Also understand as the feminist movement took over the womens movement, it also took over exactly half of the minority movement as well !!!!
 

It sounded pretty good once (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 10:20 PM April 1st, 2004 EST (#7)
I posted this here a few days ago and it sounded O.K. then so I just tweaked it a little and sent it to CSM. Here it is again + a little tweaking.

Ray

=================================================

Is there a need for a men's rights movement in the United States? Your own poll says, "Yes, Casual male-bashing has become too commonplace. 709 votes (85%)," while only 15% said, "No, Men still enjoy a privileged position." The truth is "Male Bashing" is far to mild a term to describe what is happening in America today, and the truth is the average man never was a "privileged patriarch." Check out this T-shirts at Mensbiz: (click)T-shirt
 
Considering all the facts, it is clear that there is rampant systematic prejudice that has been instituted, and is being carried out, against men by our government. The facts in support of that contention are overwhelming.
 
### Men are 80-85% of the homeless (homeless men die 20 years ahead of their time & many of them are veterans),
 
### Men have a 70% greater chance of dying of heart disease than women,
 
### Men, (in the age group 15-65) lead in all 10 categories, that are the leading causes of death in humans.
 
### Men comprise 93% of the prison population. In California there is a Commission on Education for women in prison, but none for men. Likewise, programs to help imprisoned Mothers be better Moms exist, but nothing to help men be better Fathers. There is an epidemic of prison rape against men in prison, but hey, why should the government care if men rape men? The fact the victim is male anytime seems to be O.K., just as long as the perpetrator is a man. Go figure?
 
Additionally, there are over 700 women's studies programs using our tax dollars to indoctrinate young minds (mostly female) in misandric gender ideologies. Women studies programs advocate poitically for more rights and privileges for females, while males are failing in education as a result of Title IX bigotry, glass ceiling propaganda, and men being unable to get student loans if they don't register for selective service. Under the 700 women's studies programs on college campuses there are thousands of courses vilifying "The Privileged Patriarchy."
 
In America there are over 270 women's commissions, and under there gender agenda they advocate in government for increased rights and privileges for women to the exclusion of men. Under those 270 women's commission there are many sub committees, etc. vying for more tax dollars for females. One example of there bigoted success is in Los Angeles, where there has existed for years an Office of Women's Health with millions in funding, but no Office of Men's Health has ever existed.
 
Then there is the domestic violence industry, Male citizens can't get into the majority of domestic violence shelters in America, but very likely, it will soon be possible for non citizen females from other countries to get into those shelters if they claim they are victims of domestic violence.
 
In the workplace men die very disproportionately as they earn their marginally higher salaries in "glass cellar jobs." While men are dying for a break from their tortuous professions, women just "opt out," when they want to have a baby, or get tired of working, then complain about male privilege when there years less of experience don’t get them that promotion instead of a long travailing male.
 
Yet, when men speak up about these and many other disparities they are called whiners. After all the reality is, according to gender feminists, only females are entitled to the "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness," that is guaranteed by our government under the constitution. Under gender feminism, equal justice and equal protection are in reality just nice sounding b.s. terms our founding fathers threw in to trick people into believing America was a great and free country for all. As we all know now, thanks to the enlightenment "shed" on us by women’s studies, the Founding Fathers were really just Privileged Patriarchs, incapable of doing anything right or good. How ironic that the tables should be now turned on these "Privileged,
I already posted this here a few days ago, so I just tweaked it around a little and sent it to the CSM.

Ray


Does the Titanic need lifeboats? (Score:2)
by Raymond Cuttill on 10:41 PM April 1st, 2004 EST (#8)
(User #266 Info)
I've just posted this at the Men's Hour Blog and at the Christian Science Monitor.

To answer the question, Is there a need for a men's rights movement in the United States?, I'd first like to point out that there's a need for a men's movement throughout the world. Feminism, is an international movement trying to spread hatred of men throughout the world. Ms. Grieco of NOW mentions women's issues in Nigeria, so she doesn't see the need to limit herself to the USA, especially when what happens in Nigeria can be used to male-bash all men and suggest that men don't have any problems. For NOW to suggest that name-calling isn't important is surprising. I seem to remember campaigns about whether women were called "Miss" or "Mrs" and for firemen to be called fire-fighters. The mere existence of feminism that lives to vilify and demean and undermine men dictates the need for a men's movement to protect men.

In one sense it's insulting that anyone asks the question "is their a need for a men's movement". If car workers or accountants or red haired people set up a group, no-one would have a debate on whether we need such a group. If any of those groups were set up, it would be assumed that they made some sort of point to make and the only debate would be whether their points were valid. Going and asking the women's movement if we need a men's movement is like asking democrats if we need republicans or vice versa. The day men can ask for what they want and not get debate about whether they have a valid opinion is the day we no longer need a men's movement. As long as feminism exists, then as men's movement is needed. Let's hope for women's sake that the men's movement is more generous to women than the women's movement is to men. It certainly can't be worse that what the women's movement is trying to do. Men are gradually learning that we need a men's movement. Gradually it is starting. The men's movement is coming, and it can't come too soon and when it comes, for both sexes, the world will be a better place.
Re:Does the Titanic need lifeboats? (Score:2)
by jenk on 10:19 AM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#12)
(User #1176 Info)
I have been amazed at the reception I get when talking about this issue to men. Every man to a T has been relieved to hear someone else recognize the truth. And many women can see it, but did not realize how far the feminists have sunk. I really think that people are open now in a way they weren't even a year ago. I think picking and choosing specific targets is a great way to get things moving.

The Biscuit Queen
Re:Does the Titanic need lifeboats? (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 03:20 PM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#23)
I agree, things do seem to be moving a bit better even from a year ago.
They say the wheels of justice turn slowly. That's fine just as long as they turn...!

By the way Jen, I might have asked this before but just how DID you get the title of "Biscuit Queen"? Just curious.

  Thundercloud.
  "Hoka hey!"
Re:Does the Titanic need lifeboats? (Score:2)
by jenk on 08:14 PM April 4th, 2004 EST (#30)
(User #1176 Info)
Stephen made a crack that I should get in the kitchen and make biscuits, so I thought I would give him crap back. And, I do like to bake, and make pretty damn good biscuits, if I do say so myself;-)

Oh, and I thought it would really irritate the feminazis that I am proud of my domestic abilities, as most of them would burn water.

TBQ
Re:Does the Titanic need lifeboats? (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 10:38 PM April 4th, 2004 EST (#33)
Ah.
Now I get it.
I thought maybe you ruled over a kingdom of bisquits, or something...! (^_^)

  Thundercloud.
  "Hoka hey!"
Re:Does the Titanic need lifeboats? (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 10:40 PM April 4th, 2004 EST (#34)
Oops!
I guess that should have been QUEENDOM of bisquits, not KINGdom.

  Thundercloud.
  "Hoka hey!"
Re:Does the Titanic need lifeboats? (Score:2)
by Thomas on 10:47 PM April 4th, 2004 EST (#35)
(User #280 Info)
I do like to bake, and make pretty damn good biscuits

I sure hope you're bringin' some fresh ones to the Men's Rights Congress in June. I look forward to meeting you and Dave there.

Thomas
-- Creating hostile environments for feminazis since the 1970s.

There's a discussion thread under the poll (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 02:02 AM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#10)
It has some interesting points of view. One poster, called FLcatmom, is a former member of NOW who quit after she realised what the organisation was doing to men.
Love that FLcatmom (Score:1)
by MacKenna on 09:46 AM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#11)
(User #1534 Info)
The poll is now up to 88%
Re:Love that FLcatmom (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 03:15 PM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#22)
It was up to 89% when I went there.
It is now 90% because I VOTED in FAVOR of "a men's movement", while I was there.

  Thundercloud.
  "Hoka hey!"
Re:Love that FLcatmom (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 07:02 PM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#25)
I saw at the bottom of the page that this pole will only allow a person to vote once, which I hope indicates that the numbers are accurate.

90% is a very significant percentage of people.

Ray
Re:Love that FLcatmom (Score:2)
by jenk on 06:59 PM April 3rd, 2004 EST (#27)
(User #1176 Info)
yeah, well, flcatmem showed her claws. I wouldn't be so sure she is truly won over. She spewed the party line with me then got personal when she couldn't win the debat logicaly. What a bunch of crap. The Biscuit Queen

Re:Love that FLcatmom (Score:2)
by Thomas on 08:03 PM April 3rd, 2004 EST (#28)
(User #280 Info)
yeah, well, flcatmem showed her claws. I wouldn't be so sure she is truly won over. She spewed the party line with me then got personal when she couldn't win the debat logicaly. What a bunch of crap.

I've read that thread, and you're right on the money, BQ. One thing that I've noticed is that women who were feminists in the 60s through a few years ago are universally (or nearly so) incapable of admitting that they bought into and promoted a movement that was, for the most part, driven by hatred. Despite their claims to righteousness, then and now, they wouldn't let men speak, they wouldn't admit that there was discrimination against men (such as the all-male draft perpetrated by the majority/female-elected government), and they were systematically building the culture of misandry in which we live today.

The claim that feminism in the 60s and 70s was well intentioned is nonsense. Feminism was as driven by hatred then as it is today. The fundamental problem with flcatwoman is that she is unable to accept the fact that, by being an active feminist in the past, she has advanced a culture of hatred. Her attitude toward you and others, as far as I could tell, is driven by this moral weakness. Frankly, I think that, for her own sake, she needs to accept her culpability.

Thomas
-- Creating hostile environments for feminazis since the 1970s.

Re:Love that FLcatmom (Score:2)
by jenk on 08:25 PM April 4th, 2004 EST (#31)
(User #1176 Info)
Yes. I for one fully admit I was spewing the party line and bought into it hook line and sinker. Dave and I went round and round, how men were equally under pressure from different things. I swore women always had it harder than men. I made a lot of arguements, all of them based on ignoring the male issues. I lost.

I finally had to acknowledge that eveything I had been taught was a lie, and that I had no moral high ground. And let me tell you, it is not easy giving up such a position of power. To belong to a disenfranchized group in modern western society is to have the golden ticket to the chocolate factory, and I had to rip mine in half. And I LOVE chocolate.

(can you tell I am hungary?)

Anyways, I think that is the most difficult challange facing the men's movement, is to get women to voluntarily give up power. Unfortunately, men do not have the weapons that women had. Women have no motive to hand over control. Only common decency and love of the known men in their lives will get women to change, and I don't know if that is possible on a large scale in this age.

Anyways, I am going to get some chocolate;-)
The Biscuit Queen
 
Re:Love that FLcatmom (Score:1)
by campbellzim on 10:20 PM April 4th, 2004 EST (#32)
(User #1477 Info)
Anyways, I think that is the most difficult challange facing the men's movement, is to get women to voluntarily give up power.

That is why we are going to have to take it back, and we will as soon as enough men begin to act like men. No one ever voluntarily gives up power unless they have to. There are certain individuals that have though, but not political groups ever.
Re:Love that FLcatmom (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 10:52 PM April 4th, 2004 EST (#36)
Yes, But I don't want to go too far the OTHER way where women are put through in the future what men are being put through now.
Once we have "disarmed" the feminists, let's all try to learn from the mistakes of the past made by BOTH sexes and put this "dominant-submissive-gender" thing to rest once and for all.
I just want PEACE, just peace. And unfortunatly we can't have it untill the feminist are taken down.
...I have enough aggravation...,

  Thundercloud.
  "Hoka hey!"
Re:Love that FLcatmom (Score:2)
by Thomas on 11:40 PM April 4th, 2004 EST (#38)
(User #280 Info)
Once we have "disarmed" the feminists, let's all try to learn from the mistakes of the past made by BOTH sexes and put this "dominant-submissive-gender" thing to rest once and for all.

Thundercloud, you da man!

Thomas
-- Creating hostile environments for feminazis since the 1970s.

Re:Love that FLcatmom (Score:2)
by jenk on 09:51 AM April 5th, 2004 EST (#39)
(User #1176 Info)
Amen to that.
TBQ
Re:Love that FLcatmom (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 02:00 PM April 5th, 2004 EST (#40)
Oh, well, thanks.

  Thundercloud.
  "Hoka hey!"
Here's a 2nd email to the CSM (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 01:44 PM April 2nd, 2004 EST (#16)
If you think a T-shirt saying, "Boys are Stupid Throw Rocks at Them" is much to do about nothing, then I suggest you check out this T-shirt site. Buy and wear this T-shirt or possibly one of the others. We are trying to educate ignorant people to these facts and we certainly need the help of people like you: (click) Death is the Greatest Oppressor

Death is the greatest indicator of oppression. Stop trivializing the hate war that law, government, schools, and the media are waging against males. If you think that what is happening to males in the western world is "casual male bashing," you are at least woefully ignorant, and quite possibly misandrically biased. It is clear from your article attacking Mr. Sacks, that you are insensitive to the horrors that men face in their lives. Such overt displays of hate are a disgrace to the name "Christian" so I suggest your magazine change its name simply to "The Monitor." As a Christian, such foolish articles in your magazine disgust me.

Ray


Re:Here's a 2nd email to the CSM (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on 10:55 PM April 4th, 2004 EST (#37)
Well said, Ray.
Not over the top. Just enough zing!
Let's hope they can LEARN something from it.

  Thundercloud.
  "Hoka hey!"
[an error occurred while processing this directive]