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I Googled for a transcript to the interview but couldn't find anything. Thanks for doing the leg-work. I was quoting from memory, but still came pretty close. The actual quote is:
DIANE SAWYER
(Off Camera) Has he ever hit you?
WHITNEY HOUSTON
No, he's never hit me, no. I've hit him, in anger.
DIANE SAWYER
(Voice Over) They have separated twice, but always come back to each other. And some people have worried that it's because he has a controlling hold on her, stemming from the days when Houston was under fire from black critics, who accused her of selling out, of being too white.
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Yeah, this angers me but doesn't surprise me. This is a perfect example of the kind of liberal bias that Bernard Goldberg speaks of in his book "Bias." The liberal/ feminist attitude in the media seems to be that domestic violence is acceptable as long as the perpetrators are female and the victims are adult males.
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by Anonymous User on Sunday December 15, @01:01AM EST (#3)
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"and the victims are adult males."
What you mistakeningly forget, is that it's a priori, that men aren't victims.
Jesse
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Not narrow or conservative in thought, expression, or conduct: broad, broad-minded, open-minded, progressive, tolerant. See ATTITUDE, WIDE. 2. Characterized by bounteous giving: free, freehanded, generous, handsome, lavish, munificent, openhanded, unsparing, unstinting. See GIVE. 3. Favoring civil liberties and social progress: liberalistic, progressive.
I regret to inform you Anonymous User that "the attitude in the media seems to be that domestic violence is acceptable as long as the perpetrators are female and the victims are adult males" is not a liberal notion, but a conservative one.
Liberalism is about speaking up and fighting for those that don't have a voice. Unfortuately, some feminist liberals have gone so far around the bend they've become as narrow-minded and childish as those they started out fighting against.
I love it when people try to use the "liberal bias" excuse. It's cheap, ill-informed, and detrimental to the movement we are a part of. The ideas that liberalism has traditionally embraced; equality, social justice, fighting for those who don't have a voice- have brought about the greatest changes for good in our society. Without "liberals" your neighbor would still be a slave, your wife couldn't vote, your kids would still work in sweat-shops 14 hours a day. You wouldn't have a pension, or social security, or sick days. You wouldn't be able to join a union, or get time off from work to take care of your kid. In fact, you wouldn't have even been able to write your anonymous little quip here.
As far as for a liberal bias on tv, have you bothered to watch any of the sunday morning news programs? Are George Will, John Mcglaughlin and the rest of their ilk even remotely conservative? Have you heard Tom Brokaw, Peter Jennings or Dan Rather question this War on the rights of the american people? Are Rupert Murdoch who owns Fox, Ted Turner of CNN, GE of NBC, Disney of ABC liberal? Liberal bias my ass, corporate (i.e. conservative, white collar, are you on the 'A' list?) bias, yes. And what happens when someone like Bill Maher, who wouldn't consider himself a liberal, stands up and poses some tuff question to those in power? He gets canned. Sigh.
If your for men's rights, your more liberal than most liberals. I'm so sick of this liberal/conservative debate. As George Carlin once said, "they give you the parameters of the debate, and thus control the debate". Think people, Think!
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by Anonymous User on Sunday December 15, @01:21PM EST (#8)
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"I regret to inform you Anonymous User that "the attitude in the media seems to be that domestic violence is acceptable as long as the perpetrators are female and the victims are adult males" is not a liberal notion, but a conservative one."
I don't quite understand the huge reply to my JOKE. Look man it was a joke, and I'm not exactly an anonymous user, I signed my name as Jesse at the bottom. I do not feel like making an account, that's all. I was just saying that people already make it a given that men aren't victims as a prior bias, that's all really.
"You wouldn't be able to join a union,"
I'm probably the most pro-union guy here. Some of my views are quite radical to you even, I'm sure. I'm an egalitarian of the non-authoritarian stripe. I don't feel like getting to far into them on a mensactivism site since my only purpose here is for men to enjoy the same equality as women, and to stop male HATE as soon as possible since I've had to grow up in this enviroment.
"As far as for a liberal bias on tv, have you bothered to watch any of the sunday morning news programs?"
Have you read anything by Noam Chomsky?
"Liberal bias my ass, corporate (i.e. conservative, white collar, are you on the 'A' list?) bias, yes"
I'm a blue collar worker. I'm a welder. And anyways working class people can very well work in a an office. It doesn't exactly have to do will the color of your collar.
I don't understand your outrage at me, if it is me you are replying to. Jesus christ man.
Jesse
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Jesse, I apologize. My comments were not intended for your post, but for Collins'. I got the names wrong and by the time I had posted it and saw the mistake, I couldn't figure out how to edit it. I don't know why it didn't link to his post. When I went back again and tried to make sure I was replying to his post, it posted again to yours, hence the double post. Sorry for the misunderstanding. My bad. Now let's see if this winds up in the right slot.
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Your "liberal" buddies include:
Ted Turner
Michael Eisner
Ted Kennedy
Barbra Streisand
Alec Baldwin
Gloria Steinem
Susan Estridch [sic]
Al Gore
Gloria Aldred
Hillary! Clinton
Bill Clinton
Dan Savage
Organizations supporting modern liberal causes include, but are not limited to:
PETA
ALF
NOW
NAMBLA
ACT-UP
Now, you can howl about how "perverted" these things are, and claim they are not liberal. They are publicized as liberal, claim to be liberal, and endorsed by the power structure that defines itself as and is commonly accepted as being Liberal.
Most members of the press endorse positions held by these groups and try to present them in as favorable a light as possible. Like tossing softballs to Whitney Houston, and glossing over difficult results that go contrary to their accepted and current wisdom.
You don't like the word conservative? Well, I'm sorry. I'm a libertarian and often tagged with the label myself, but I find I have a lot more in common with conservatives than liberals. It might be different in Europe, or in years gone by, but since I live in the here-and-now in the US, I deal. And whether you like it or not, if you are truly a "Classical Liberal" then you have a whole hell of a lot more in common too. Wasn't all to long ago that Mister William F. Buckley was regarded as a liberal.
---- Burn, Baby, Burn ----
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And don't forget Hanoi-Jane Fonda
Or Irac-Sean Penn.
TC.
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by Anonymous User on Tuesday December 17, @08:31PM EST (#22)
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you guys forgot to add Warren Farrel as well.
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Sadly, the word "liberal" has been co-opted by people who are really very illiberal indeed. You are technically correct: liberal thinkers would embrace men's rights as a logical, free-thinking reaction to the current situation in America. However, people who like to brand themselves as "liberal" are really trying to conserve movements and ideas that were progressive thirty years ago but are now retrograde.
The world is a confusing place, and descriptions of the world (including terms like "liberal") doubly so.
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Not narrow or conservative in thought, expression, or conduct: broad, broad-minded, open-minded, progressive, tolerant. See ATTITUDE, WIDE. 2. Characterized by bounteous giving: free, freehanded, generous, handsome, lavish, munificent, openhanded, unsparing, unstinting. See GIVE. 3. Favoring civil liberties and social progress: liberalistic, progressive.
I regret to inform you Anonymous User that "the attitude in the media seems to be that domestic violence is acceptable as long as the perpetrators are female and the victims are adult males" is not a liberal notion, but a conservative one.
Liberalism is about speaking up and fighting for those that don't have a voice. Unfortuately, some feminist liberals have gone so far around the bend they've become as narrow-minded and childish as those they started out fighting against.
I love it when people try to use the "liberal bias" excuse. It's cheap, ill-informed, and detrimental to the movement we are a part of. The ideas that liberalism has traditionally embraced; equality, social justice, fighting for those who don't have a voice- have brought about the greatest changes for good in our society. Without "liberals" your neighbor would still be a slave, your wife couldn't vote, your kids would still work in sweat-shops 14 hours a day. You wouldn't have a pension, or social security, or sick days. You wouldn't be able to join a union, or get time off from work to take care of your kid. In fact, you wouldn't have even been able to write your anonymous little quip here.
As far as for a liberal bias on tv, have you bothered to watch any of the sunday morning news programs? Are George Will, John Mcglaughlin and the rest of their ilk even remotely conservative? Have you heard Tom Brokaw, Peter Jennings or Dan Rather question this War on the rights of the american people? Are Rupert Murdoch who owns Fox, Ted Turner of CNN, GE of NBC, Disney of ABC liberal? Liberal bias my ass, corporate (i.e. conservative, white collar, are you on the 'A' list?) bias, yes. And what happens when someone like Bill Maher, who wouldn't consider himself a liberal, stands up and poses some tuff question to those in power? He gets canned. Sigh.
If your for men's rights, your more liberal than most liberals. I'm so sick of this liberal/conservative debate. As George Carlin once said, "they give you the parameters of the debate, and thus control the debate". Think people, Think!
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Additionally, I'll add that the term "liberal" originally encompassed those who believed in laissez-faire capitalism. (Hence the term "classical liberal".)
The term liberal has truly been stolen by modern leftists. It's time the term be taken back. Which is why I always tell modern pseudo-liberals who claim to be "liberal" that they're not liberal at all. I am the true liberal. I'm a laissez-faire capitalist. I place the individual over society and not the other way around.
"Force and mind are opposites; morality ends where a gun begins." -John Galt
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> The term liberal has truly been stolen by modern
> leftists. It's time the term be taken back. Which
> is why I always tell modern pseudo-liberals who
> claim to be "liberal" that they're not liberal at
> all. I am the true liberal. I'm a laissez-faire
> capitalist. I place the individual over society
> and not the other way around.
I agree 100%. Liberalism is about equality. Most conservative ideologies have a form of inequality. Gender feminism, extreme nationalism, etc.
PUNISHMENT AND CRIME
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The "proper" definitions of what is a conservative and what is a liberal are not very well known, nor are they heavily embraced by most who claim one or the other today.
"Most conservative ideologies have a form of inequality. Gender feminism, extreme nationalism, etc."
I neither regard myself as an extreme nationalist nor a gender feminist, nor a racist. But I DO regard myself as a conservative. Attaching those labels to me is quite hurtful, not to mention being innacurate. The current trials being applied to U.S. Senator Trent Lott are a good example. While I'm sure Lott has his personal feelings on matters of race, his voting record demonstrates his ideals (inasfaras race issues are concerned). This mornining, on ABC, Spike Lee accused Lott of being "a card-carrying member of the KKK..." He got it wrong, of course. Senator Robert Byrd (a Democrat) is (or was) a card-carrying member of the KKK.
In fact, today's American "conservatives" endeavor to be color- and gender- blind, though they do not endeavor as much to be religion blind. They seek minimum government and economic opportunity. In fact, over the decades since the Civil War, it is the Republican Party that has been most progressive on racial issues, not the Democrats. I note that Strom Thrumond, during his most racist years, was a Democrat.
This is not the place to get into this discussion, though. I suspect there are enough people here who identify with either of the two or neither of the two where all that matters HERE is men's rights.
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Liberalism is about speaking up and fighting for those that don't have a voice.
Like unborn children? Like those in Iraq who cannot voice dissent against their leader?
Liberalism, as it is currently implemented in the United States, is not about speaking up and fighting for those who don't have a voice. It is about self-righteousness and hypocrisy. It is about elitism. It is about arrogance and power. It is about the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer. It is about taking a position because it's chic, rather than taking a position based on it's moral or human value.
You are confusing Liberalism with liberalism. Mother Teresa was a liberal. Barbara Streisand is a Liberal.
Liberals are those who call themselves environmentalists, yet still drive their private automobiles. Liberals are those who complain about world hunger, yet still eat at restaurants. Liberals are those who support gay marriage, but don't raise an eyebrow when Thomas Green in Utah is sent to prison for the "crime" of polygamy. Liberals are those who express concern about the AIDS epidemic in Africa, yet have no clue how many Africans have died from malaria.
My organization raises about 1 million dollars each year for charity. Sounds good, until you realize that it costs them more than 1 million dollars just to raise this money. It's not about helping others. If it was, the fund raising costs would be quietly given to those in need. Instead, it's all about showing others that "they care." That's Liberalism.
Barbara Streisand made sure that the world would be impressed by her environmental consciousness when she once told the press that she shared a cab when visiting another city. However, she failed to mention that she got to that city by flying across the country in her private jet. That's Liberalism.
Liberalism is made up of those people who are too selfish to help anyone but themselves. It's about words, because words are easier than action. It's about sticking your noise into the air and telling everyone what a wonderful person you are because you believe in the current politically correct cause.
This is the applied definition of Liberalism in our country. It is this Liberalism that is anti-man (men are not a politically correct cause), and it is this Liberalism that dominates the media and academia. And yes, Ted Turner and Michael Eisner are Liberals.
If you really care, then you will sacrifice yourself to help the countless people who are less fortunate or those who are being abused and/or having their freedoms denied. Dropping 5 dollars in the Salvation Army bucket at Christmas and then feeling good about this all year doesn't count.
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"...she failed to mention that she got to that city by flying across the country in her private jet. That's Liberalism."
Actually, that's not Liberalism so much as it's Limousine Liberalism. Streisand migh also be accused of being a Latte Liberal at one time or another. :-)
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But it's not liberalism at all. Like I stated in my previous post, liberalism in its classical form has little-to-nothing to do with the modern perversion.
The problem is that most people are willing to let the Left steal the term, when it never belonged to them in the first place. To be "liberal" and a proponent of government intervention in the economy and private property is a contradiction in terms. To be a true liberal is to be an advocate of laissez-faire capitalism: the ultimate form of limited government.
When one lets his opponent dictate and define the terminology, then he's already lost half the battle. I refuse to do that.
So to all you leftists reading this: The term "liberal" was never yours. You stole it. I'm simply taking it back. You were probably never a true liberal, and probably never will be. I'm the true liberal here. Come up with your own term to describe yourself.
Ironically, the modern pseudo-liberals are simply applying their ideology to the term. They feel they are entitled to the unearned in terms of money (via their redistribution of wealth), and apparently they feel they are entitled to unearned terminology as well. (Via stealing a word which was never theirs, but they've claimed nonetheless.)
Ayn Rand called 'em looters, and rightfully so.
"Force and mind are opposites; morality ends where a gun begins." -John Galt
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Actually, I spent some time thinking about this on my commute home last night. It really is true that the words "liberal" and "conservative" have nothing to do with their literal definition when applied to political machinations. They're just labels we choose to hang on things to get political party affiliation out of the way, because party affiliations are sometimes more misleading than the afore-mentioned, ill-selected adjectives. As painful and as misleading as it is, though, efficiency of language demands that we use SOME label, just as we use the term "feminist."
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...And lest we forget...,
In our society, any man who is violent towards women is an abomination, an oppressor, a "control freak", and a blaspheimer.(SP?)
Conversely, any WOMAN who is violent towards men is a hero, a "strong woman" who "Puts the Dog in his place!" and is "takein' charge!".
Our society accepts this, our intertainment industry glorifies it. and our court system perpetuates it.
One more thing.
I find it flat-out amazeing that just after Houston admits that she abuses Brown, Sawyer, (in voice over) says, "And some people have worried that because HE (Brown) HAS A CONTROLING HOLD ON HER..."
WHAT?!!!?
Just a minuet, there! ask any pheminist if domestic violence is a FORM OF CONTROL, and they will invairiably say "YES"!
So if Brown has NEVER hit Whitey, but Whitney has hit Brown, as she HERSELF has said, Then who the F#*k is controling who?!!??
If the Marx-fem's definition is to be adheared to, then it is HOUSTON, not BROWN who has "a controling hold"!!!
Excuse me..., You all remeber that wall I have banged my head against, in times like this?
Well, I need to go put some more dents in it, right now.
Geez...!
TC.
(BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG... )
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by Anonymous User on Sunday December 15, @02:44PM EST (#9)
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Thundercloud,
Don't abuse yourself. Pheminists abuse you enough all ready. Stay strong and keep low. You're a great warrior.
Your bro
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Thanks, AU.
Maybe I should start banging feminist's heads against that wall instead.
NOTE TO FEMINISTS.
Don't get your panties in a bunch, ladies, It's an empty threat.
TC.
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Let's not be in dispair. When more men will realise that they are oppressed (which should happen within the next two decades) their political pressure will be enough to return equality.
PUNISHMENT AND CRIME
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I like the way that Whitney says,
"I hit him once; in anger."
As though that last bit somehow makes it all better. Apparently Diane Sawyer thought so too, as she didn't press the point.
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