|
This discussion has been archived.
No new comments can be posted.
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Can we just get this guy to say that men's DV shelters are needed? Can we just get him to say that men are as deserving of support, counseling, and enforcement as men? Get we just get him to TAK A POSITION? Or is he just going to stay behind the research?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
"...men are as deserving of support, counseling, and enforcement as men..."
Sorry. I hit the SUBMIT button too fast. I meant "Can we just get this guy to say that men are as deserving of support, counseling, and enforcement as WOMEN?"
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Dr. Straus is (understandably) very quick to insist on acknowledging women's greater vulnerability to serious physical injury related to DV. But at least he speaks out in favor of recognizing male victims and female perpetrators. For that reason he has been rejected by many in the DV industry.
Based on what's reported I don't doubt that women are seven times more likely to suffer physical injury. I know male victims are less likely than female victims to report their abuse. I can't help but wonder if a lot of males who suffer physical injury at the hands of their female partners/ spouses never report it as DV injury. Maybe they show up in the ER or doctor's office and report it as a home accident or sports injury, or something else.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
by Anonymous User on Thursday August 15, @12:54PM EST (#4)
|
|
|
|
|
Based on what's reported I don't doubt that women are seven times more likely to suffer physical injury. I know male victims are less likely than female victims to report their abuse. I can't help but wonder if a lot of males who suffer physical injury at the hands of their female partners/ spouses never report it as DV injury. Maybe they show up in the ER or doctor's office and report it as a home accident or sports injury, or something else.
While I applaud Dr. Straus' work on this subject, I *do* dispute the seven times more likely stat. The reason is evidenced in other DV reports. Women are more likely to use weapons or other means of attack to make up for their lack of size or strength. Lorena Bobbitt waited for her husband to go to sleep, you know? Some women sneak up and push men down the stairs, too.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
When my then-wife was attacking me, I made a few visits to ER. The injuries were always reported as 'accidents' or the like by the ER doctors, which made me angry at the time. Later, it occurred to me that those doctors may have saved me a lot of grief - after all, if I had gotten them to report a DV incident, who would have been arrested? Me, most likely.
There are a whole set of interlocking circumstances that have to change before men can report DV and realistically expect to be believed and see action taken.
- Where applicable, arrest procedures have to be changed to blind to sex.
- ER staff have to be trained to view men as well as women as potential DV targets.
- Men need safe places to go with their children, and support in leaving abusive wives.
- Men need to realize that DV directed against them is just as bad as DV directed against women
- Men need to realize that there need be no shame attached to being a DV target.
We here all realize this (and can probably add to the list). Reports like Dr. Straus' represent an opening wedge we can exploit to begin cutting through barriers to public awareness and sexist law, but given the current media perspective and the real power of the DV industry, I believe we will offer more help to more men by doing for ourselves. The other option is to try and force government bureaucracies that benefit from the "man-bad/woman-good" paradigm to give up their power in favor of equality - a worthy goal that should be pursued, but one that doesn't help the guy with the broken wrist being chased out of his home by an irate wife right now.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I think the world is better off if he doesn't take a position, though I share your frustration.
Chances are that he agrees with you. However, the very reason that so many in the DV racket have so little credibility, is that they are activists posing as researchers. The instant Strauss takes a position on DV that is politicized like that, feminists will, in their typically hypocritical fashion, accuse him of bias and attempt to discount his research on that basis. His research is too important to allow that to happen.
So, we ought to be thankful that the real work of tracking patterns of violence is still being done by people with no ideological axe to grind. We are lucky to have Dr. Strauss as a source of information. We don't need him as a source of rhetoric.
If his conclusions are ones that we happen to appreciate, that does not make it his obligation to take up our torch. I think he is right not to. How difficult it would be indeed, if every single source of untainted information regarding DV became a political champion for men's rights. The data they would produced would be unavoidably skewed, whether they wanted it to be or not. They would be laughed into the fringe, precisely as have feminist sociologists and their ilk.
Count your blessings, fellas. Strauss is one of them, precisely BECAUSE he is an objective and meticulous devotee of the truth, and devoid of philosophical taint.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
There is *no question* about men needing shelters and we have more than a few good reasons to gain them.
The assertion by Straus that DV has become a social investment is no b.s. thats for sure and here is the key problem to getting shelters for men and that is 'coercion'. Just as Straus has said that most instances of violence is because of 'coercion' tactics such is the same within the "social movement" of dv with the female perspective.
I have a great friend who crashes at my house regularily because his common law wife(my cousin) abuses him in almost every fasion. Usually its about money(for him to make more). I get all kinds if slack from her,her parents and even his mother for letting him have a place to stay. All the while she is threatening to kick him out onto the street and locking him out of the house etc..etc... The only reason she is pissed at me is because it takes away her leverage for abusing him. She would much better like it if he was on the streets begging her from his hands and knees. The end point fembots will deny this even to themselves to maintain the upper hand as an individidual in a collective organization based on sex.
Secondly, an arguement for men should be that a men's shelter will be in the best interest of 'reducing violence'. Meaning if men have a place to go in these situtations to get counciling or a place to rest etc.. he will not be forced to 'stand his ground' so to speak. We are giving men a back door option, a way out, a place to go in distress. My friend is lucky he can come to my house but there are millions and millions that are not so lucky.
This is not only for the abused man, but the male abuser as well. If many of the cases are because of 'self defence' than instead of retaliation a man can have somewhere to go a place to cool down. I know it still sounds like the burden is still on the man but in the overall picture it leads to bigger and better things and, we can use fembot arguements against themselves in order to force them to build shelters for men. Of course all the while deconstructing the myths they have.
I wish I could have gone up against that guy on the radio, his gibberish was weak at best. Unfortuanately Straus is not much of a PR guy himself but thats okay as long as he continues with the objective data collecting he will bring us closer to a solution for both sexes.
Challenging anyone who hates Straus will be easy based on a look at their 'social investment'. Remind them of the importance of 'Objective Investment'.
.
http://www.fathersforlife.org/fv/Dan_Lynch_on_EP.h tm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
by Anonymous User on Friday August 16, @02:02AM EST (#14)
|
|
|
|
|
This may be one for the "DUH", file, on my part.
but after reading Nazgul's and Dan lynch's posts it "dawned" on me that, inequality wouldn't be so prevalant if it weren't so PROFITABLE.
...I'm not slow, it just takes me a bit longer, than some, to get there.
Thundercloud.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
...it "dawned" on me that, inequality wouldn't be so prevalant if it weren't so PROFITABLE.
This is a good point. In the Western world there is no longer any practical reason or justification for inequality of any kind. The enormous physical resources at our disposal, the massive wealth of our nations, our extensive communications networks and organised public services are sufficient to provide everyone with a comfortable standard of living, ample freedoms, and fair and equal representation under the law. The maintenance of inequality and the creation of new inequalities is purely a political act. Without these inequalities, governments become minor bureaucracies concerned with road maintenance, public hygiene and other unglamourous administrative tasks. While this would be to the enormous benefit of most people, it would not be to the benefit of those who seek power and the wealth and privilege it brings. Consequently there is a continual need to create endless crises by artificially setting one section of society up against another. Although this is done in the name of equality, the practical outcome is inequality, supported - as are all inequalities - by the movements of large sums of money between vested interests.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Indeed. All organizations (and organisms) seek to propagate their interests; it's the first protocol: survival.
If a group that seeks the elimination of something comes to close to success, they have to pull back. Why? They will lose their reason for being if successful, and no group or person wants that.
This is why the "fembots" (as someone on this board calls them) just keep making up more and more outrageous stuff and citing it as an "example" of this or that -- they need a "raison d'etre", they need to keep convincing people (mostly women) to send them money so they don't need to get real jobs and be responsible for themselves (instead of blaming men, "society", etc. for all their problems).
Did Margaret Thatcher need feminine welfare feminism to pitch for them? Did Madeleine Albright? Did Susan B. Anthony?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
"it "dawned" on me that, inequality wouldn't be so prevalant if it weren't so PROFITABLE. "
You have hit the nail on the head, Thundercloud. And if you mail me I can show you just exactly how deep it goes. Its not only people who have become emotionally invested in this (based on the propaganda) but universities are 'selling' courses wholesale at descriminating against men. Thats why its in the public sector and thats why its so hard to fight.
Case law after cas law builds up and they rely on the information that suits them. By the way its not just women its men and many many of them. From politicians to Proffesors in sociology such as Desmond Ellis (my proffessor) who kept inserting feminist propaganda in his classes to raise temperatures. He has an entire outfit at york u. where women are the abused. The courses are for councilors etc, and they virtually study how men are violent.
It is the giant propaganda house and it exists for money. Whats worse is that these people become "qualified" to determine whether or not 'men' will become violent or not when released from jail. These guys are not even remoteley getting a fair chance.
These people train judges and produce videos. Descrimination is a giant cash cow. Judges , offices, lawyers councilor workers all being indoctrinated with anti-male bias.
What should really be in the "duh" file, is how those supposedly intelligent people eat all this garbage up so easily.
.
http://www.fathersforlife.org/fv/Dan_Lynch_on_EP.h tm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
First they came after the evil patriarchy and demonized all men, then Janet Reno came after the child abusers in a facade of truths, half truths, and lies, and the media knee jerked on cue, “It could be the guy next door, those kind are not few.” ...then on to the work place where you sexually harassed, you brutish male you, and when the Title IX officer smiled, I saw in her thoughts, “You’ll be sorry you ever dated before I’m through.” Domestic violence law came next or about the same time on waves of myths and half truths, it was a style that we knew. “95% of domestic violence is committed by men so its 100% guilty till proven innocent for the demon male brute.” I was dizzy with disbelief and terrified to move then a Stanford professor decreed, “CRIMES ARE BY MEN,” so this must include you. How did this happen? It had all worked so well, when a little voice answered, “they had practice.” “This has all happened before on the Blacks and the Jews.” On to the boys, the playgrounds, the schools... feminize the lot of them, because now it’s girls rule. If your flunking your classes and dying in war, just cover your testicles and wait for the next hit for the battering of men is the accepted thing to do when law mocks justice and the feminists rule.
Ray
Pastor Martin Niemoller, anti-Nazi activist, wrote these words, “First the came for the Jews and I did not speak out, because I was not a Jew. Then they came for the communists and I did not speak out because I was not a communist. Then they came for the trade unionists and I did not speak out because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for me and by then there was no one left to speak out for me.”
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
$1 out of every $5, NOW! Statistics(1) are out and the thinly veiled results are shocking to say the least. In California in a 10 year period from 1988 to 1998 there was a 392% increase in the number of domestic violence arrests of women. To put that another way 392% more women were arrested for domestic violence in 1998 than were arrested for the same crime in 1988.
Probably the most unanticipated twist to this news is the fact that this information is coming from the very same people, who I consider to be among the perpetrators of inequities in domestic violence law. These are the people who favor the arrest of men and the non-blaming, special treatment of women in all matters of domestic violence. In their own words, “the woman is the victim,” “don’t blame the victim,” “she’s a victim of “battered woman syndrome”, etc.”” The domestic violence industries’ statistics clearly indicate that, today, in California for every four (4) female victims of domestic violence there is one (1) male victim, yet, to the best of my knowledge, not one penny of the billions being allocated to violence against women is going to male victims of domestic violence. This is a violation of the Constitution of the United States, 14 th amendment, that guarantees the equal protection of all citizens under its law.
The time for the Draconian brutalizaton of men to stop is now. The hate crime of domestic violence law must be changed to accurately reflect the realities of domestic violence and not some radical feminist agenda. Starting immediately $1 of every $5 allocated to domestic violence must go to battered male victims and this must be accounted for to prove that the money is not being misspent by anyone. Additionally, one (1) battered women’s shelter in every five (5) must be converted to men only, or one (1) bed in every five (5) in all shelters must be available at all times for male domestic violence victims. Victim advocacy must also provide 20% of its services to help male victims of domestic violence as their legal action, against the female batterer, winds its way through the court system. Training of police officers must be truthful about the insurmountable evidence that reveals that males are as often victims of domestic violence as women, and that men have always been a far greater percentage of the victim statistics than was allowed to be documented. Domestic violence anger management classes must fully include the role of the female as perpetrator and batterer in domestic violence, and more of these anger management classes must be made available to abusive and violent females. In all areas of the Violence Against Women Act as it is enforced in California, $1 in every $5 must be spent to address the needs of the male victims of domestic violence, and this must begin immediately. WHO KNOWS WHAT THE NUMBERS WILL REVEAL, WHEN THE WHOLE TRUTH IS FINALLY TOLD?
(1) Report on Arrests for Domestic Violence in California, 1998, State of California, Office of the Attorney General, Bureaus of Criminal Information and Analysis, Criminal Justice Statistics Center Report Series, Volume 1, Number 3 - August 1999
Ray
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
by Anonymous User on Thursday August 15, @07:18PM EST (#11)
|
|
|
|
|
The pine wood book stand I made to prop college text books on is 16 inches long by 9 3/4 inches high it has a 7 inch 2 by 4 split diagonally and the two pieces are mounted to the back in such a way (opposing each other) as to give books the proper angle for reading. There's a 1 inch by 3 inch lip (16 inches long) at the bottom for the books to rest on. It probably weighs about 2 or 3 pounds. The night I asked my now ex-wife for a divorce to get away from the violence, she went beserk and started destroying everything in the house. I remember saying stop it, stop it as she repeatedly picked up and threw her pewter dish into the floor. When she stopped doing that she picked up the book stand wound up her whole body and threw it with all her might straight at me. Some part of the book stand connected dead on with the raised bone on the left side of my left leg about one inch under the cartledge. I weighed 205 lbs. then, but due to the force of her blow my leg was taken out from under me and I went down like a rock. I went down in excruciating pain in a heap. I was on crutches for a week after that, and the bone was swollen for months.
A few minutes after her savage attack, as I was lying in bed with ice on my injury, I looked down the hall and saw her in the kitchen lightly dragging one of those serrated steak knives over her wrist. I limped to the kitchen holding on to the walls and slowly reached for the knife, never saying a word, she let me take it from her hand, and there was no blood where she had been dragging the sharp edge over her veins.
I told her later I could have had her arrested for what she did to me, not knowing anything about how d.v. law worked. It was about a month or two later when she was again in one of those moods, again using profanity, and threatening violence that she called the police, started screaming into the phone, talking crazy. When the police arrived she showed them a week or two old bruise that I think she may have got moving a file cabinet but I don't know. I was arrested and held for 12 hours. When I talked to the female detective she told me that 95% of d.v. was committed by men. I had never heard that statistic before. Very calmly I told her to look into my eyes and waited until our eyes where staring into mine, then I said, "your looking at that 5%." I was released very shortly after that and given a peice of paper that said, "hereafter it shall be as if you were never arrested, but instead detained."
About two years later as I was trying to renew my K-12 teaching credential I found out the police still maintained an "arrest" file on me. After a few further inquiries, I filed a complaint with internal affairs (the fox watching the chicken coop) about the whole thing. Their final conclusion was that I was the primary aggressor. Since then my credential has been approved. I could go on with the details of the horror of that victimization, but I won't. You get the idea.
It's just that when I hear things like women are 7 times more likely to be injured in d.v. it brings back a lot of bad memories, and I think what hurts most of all is that I feel so betrayed by things I believed in. No wonder 4 out of 5 suicides are male. If I didn't have such a strong moral constitution and such loving biological family members I would probably be just one of those eternally silenced voices that Dr. Straus doesn't hear or include in his research.
Women are seven times more likely to be injured, Dr. Straus do you have any bridges for sale?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I think the 7/1 ratio thing is a bone Straus throws to feminists. When his work first came out showing women as frequently violent as men, he came under heavy feminist criticism (to say the least). So he threw a question about injury into his next set of surveys without the same kind of controls he puts on the DV questionaire, crunches the numbers, and comes up with a 7 to 1 ratio.
More reliable studies show it is more like 2 to 1.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I don't think all the Data is in on the "injuries" thats for sure. Men are taught to be tuff, I bet they don't even admit it on anonymous questionaires that they were hurt.
But I can gurantee you that we will be hearing this 7 to 1 ratio like theres no tomorrow. The feminist canteen squad will select that quote, (and that quote only no doubt) to put on bill boards across the country.
I think it is in our best interest to find out exactly what is mean by this data.
.
http://www.fathersforlife.org/fv/Dan_Lynch_on_EP.h tm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I'd also like to see that 'false accusations' are being seen as a form of abuse. Fembots are saying that false accusations are no more reported than any other crime. Which is total bullshit consider the high motivations there now is for someone to falsely accuse someone.
In canada there is even 'victim compensation' for it now, that means they get money. Let alone whatever they want when things don't go their way. Such as in child custody disputes. If you add false accusations to the list as a form of abuse and treat it as a crime like a mugging or an attempted murder we will begin to see how wide spread it really is. If we continue to look at it the way we have been means cops admitting that they have been filing false charges , that judges have been convicting innocent people that crowns have been prosicuting the innocent and that defence lawyers haven't been defending their clients to their full capacities.
.
http://www.fathersforlife.org/fv/Dan_Lynch_on_EP.h tm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
We should be glad about Straus' work, but if we disagree with him, we shouldn't be afraid to say so. One of the great problems with mainstream feminism is its insistence on groupthink.
Here's a compelling article by Erin Pizzey, the first person to open a shelter for battered wives. It gives a brief description of the hijacking of the anti-DV movement. She refers to a study "from Leicester Royal Infirmary in England that reported that their findings confirmed that men and women were equally victims of violent assault but that men injuries were more horrific because they were caused by weapons."
Another important quote from the article: "Women began to falsify information and accuse their partners of domestic violence as a preamble to requesting a divorce. Men were accused of molesting their children and many jailed without evidence. Men could be removed from their homes merely by an allegation from their partner that they were 'in fear.' No physical corroborating evidence of violence behaviour was necessary. Courts refused to discipline women who refused to allow men access to their children. Men had a one in ten chance of losing contact with their children altogether. A bitter war between men and women became a reality."
Another important fact to have handy -- "One piece of research which has managed not to see the light of day is that the worst form of violence does not occur between men and women or even between men and men, but occurs between women and women. Lesbian violence is very violent and a source of great embarrassment to the radical feminist movement. In a sample of 1,099 lesbians, Lie and Gentlewarrior (in press) found that 52% of the respondents have been abused by a female lover or partner."
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
"Lesbian violence is very violent and a source of great embarrassment to the radical feminist movement. In a sample of 1,099 lesbians, Lie and Gentlewarrior (in press) found that 52% of the respondents have been abused by a female lover or partner."
Feminists usually digress the point then go on about how things are in China or where ever. They don't know whats going on in this country what makes them think they know whats going on in *that* country. :o)
I could absolutely believe that lesbians are the worst, as you now have two people that are considered *unaccountable* beings. Funny, but the stuff I have read lead me to believe that it was the effeminant of the duo that was the most violent. Imagine if they both are.
I also want to assert that false accusations are an extreme form of abuse with *unknowable* outcomes, possibly death. Which is why I will always consider it attempted murder, especially if the person knowlingly attempts to send someone to jail or prison.
Its unfortunate that Erin Prizzy doesn't get the recognition she deserves for all her efforts and years on the front lines.
I think that men need a place to go, a men's shelter is just as important at reducing violence and conflict. Otherwise men are forced to stay and hold their ground. It is an absolute must that men have this back door policy or lesbians for that matter.
.
http://www.fathersforlife.org/fv/Dan_Lynch_on_EP.h tm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
false accusations are an extreme form of abuse with *unknowable* outcomes, possibly death. Which is why I will always consider it attempted murder
Given the high rates of rape and AIDS in prison, especially men's prisons, false accusations of felonies are attempted murder.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
In the animal kingdom there is no more ferocious and savage beast than the female protecting her territory. If a man is cohabitating with a female for God's sake beware. In her mind you are in her domain. Any infringement on her territory results in a defensive, physical ferocity and savagery that will stun your senses, if not your actual body. I have heard "experts" explain that this is due to the nesting instinct that is activated in females subsequent to sexual intimacy and procreative activity. As one who has extensively observed the behavior of animals in the wild I find this expalnation highly plausible and am surprised that it has not been given wider study by "domestic violence experts," who, for lack of a better word, are deficient to the many obvious, violent actions of the female partner. There is a lot of biased and inaccurate work out there that most men realize is over obviously tainted by the politics of the domestic violence industry.
Domestic Violence law is the most preposterous scam of the millennia (old and new), and a lot of the research supporting this banner of the feminist agenda is a politically motivated sham.
Ray
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
by Anonymous User on Saturday August 17, @05:53PM EST (#23)
|
|
|
|
|
Sam the Sham and the Pharaohs?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
by Anonymous User on Sunday August 18, @03:05AM EST (#25)
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
by Anonymous User on Sunday August 18, @10:00AM EST (#26)
|
|
|
|
|
Rock band from the 60's. You're probably too young to remember. Their hit, "Wooly Bully (no reference to anything written here)."
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
by Anonymous User on Monday August 19, @12:15AM EST (#34)
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
by Anonymous User on Sunday August 18, @02:11AM EST (#24)
|
|
|
|
|
((("Lesbian violence is very violent and a source of great embarassment to the radical feminist movement.")))
I am really GLAD some one (Dan Lynch.) brought this up.
Did you know that LESBIAN DOMESTIC VIOLENCE is thrown in with domestic violence against Women in GENERAL?!?
THIS is how they make it "seem" like MOST of the DV is perpetrated by MEN!!
Just another one of those little things the MEDIA carefully omits to controll thought on an issue.
..I have ENOUGH aggrevation...,
Thundercloud.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Thundercloud:
Thank you, I didn't know that. So, when they say a woman is battered every --seconds, they are failing to tell you that women battering women is figured into that statistic. If they are included, then they have destroyed the ability to honestly differentiate between d.v. committed by men or lesbians against women. ...and lesbians are some of the most vocally active, blaming the whole d.v. thing on men. Dr. Straus where is your study of domestic violence committed by women against women, and where is your study of lesbian involvement in organizations like Family Violence Prevention Fund (FVPF) that try to place the whole balme for this issue on men? A key piece of your homework is missing! Help! "The deeds of darkness (misleading use of statistics for political purposes) can not hide in the light of day."
Ray
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
where is your study of domestic violence committed by women against women
I'd also like to see a study of violence in gay male relationships. It would be interesting if the statistically least violent relationships were those that had no women in them. That could well be the case, since in heterosexual relationships, it's usually the woman who initiates the violence.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
"I'd also like to see a study of violence in gay male relationships. "
I think ultimately its that we are humans first genders second. Interpersonal relationships and the dynamics of coercion for one's needs or wants.
We can all manipulate, we can all use pressure tactics, we can all lie, we can all be jealous. And for the courts and the dv industries to completly ignore that about all of us is completely irresponsible. Well except for the dv industry they of course are getting their desired effect.
I think we should have a salute to Erin Prizzey, someone who is actually trying to find a solution. And if Im correct the founder of DV shelters. How completely ironic that feminists have turned their backs on her and her amazing work as a woman. I also noticed feminists turn their backs on conservative women as well when they become successful. Interesting.
It was actually Thomas who brought up the lesbian thing I think Thundercloud, not that it matters. But good work on that research Thundercloud that is something that I didnt know about stacking the stats. But not to be a contrarian can you post a site or where I can find the research?
I have actually found that type of stacking before in racial crimes. Personally I think this stuff creates more hostility between racial and gender divides which ultamately is the intended outcome for those so invested in that sort of thing.
,
http://www.fathersforlife.org/fv/Dan_Lynch_on_EP.h tm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
In d.v. the real truth lies somewhere in the middle. The reality is not the scam that the rad fems have been running through the legal system for the past numbers of years,
As long as the rad fems and their toady politicians and toady statisticians want to play hardball with dishonest information, then they can expect to see all the smoke I can muster on the fastball coming atraight at the illogic of their bats.
Ray
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
by Anonymous User on Monday August 19, @12:41AM EST (#35)
|
|
|
|
|
((("can you post a site or where I can find the research?")))
Sorry, Dan.
This is one of those studies I heard, a while back. All I can remember is the source WAS legitimate.
Because or that study, earlier this year, I decided to do my own research on the matter of lesbian DV.
I began, simply enough, by entering the key-words "Same sex domestic violence." And "Lesbian domestic violence."
If memory serves me, I THINK I ended up with data from the 'Colorado department of health'. As well as some statistical data from the F.B.I.
BOTH stated clearly that Lesbian DV was very high.
I just wish I could remember where I got the info on Lesbian DV being shuffled in with ALL domestic violence against women
it IS true, though.
I think anyone who wants to track down that information could do so, with a bit of determination.
Sorry I couldn't be MORE helpful.
Thundercloud.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
"As long as the rad fems and their toady politicians and toady statisticians want to play hardball with dishonest information, then they can expect to see all the smoke I can muster on the fastball coming atraight at the illogic of their bats. "
Remember to always try and keep a smile about you while doing your work. : )
http://www.fathersforlife.org/fv/Dan_Lynch_on_EP.h tm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
by Anonymous User on Sunday August 18, @10:52PM EST (#33)
|
|
|
|
|
I'd like to see a study on how women could initiate most of the violence when so many of them are assaulted AFTER they've left the male and whilst living at a new residence.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
" I'd like to see a study on how women could initiate most of the violence when so many of them are assaulted AFTER they've left the male and whilst living at a new residence. "
I'd like to see a study on how a woman could drive 45 mins up a mountain side to her ex-husband's house accidently shoot him and his new wife and claim it was a suicide attempt. But I guess we're both dreaming.
.
http://www.fathersforlife.org/fv/Dan_Lynch_on_EP.h tm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
by Anonymous User on Monday August 19, @01:27AM EST (#39)
|
|
|
|
|
Here's the problem;
I see and hear ALOT of statistical data bantered around, about who initiates DV more often and who doesn't.
Frankly, I don't know the real ansewer to that question. It may be true, that Women initiate it more often than men, it may not. I don't really know. And I don't feel comfortable saying it IS true, untill I know for SURE.
The reason I PERSONALY believe it may be true, is because (alot of) Women hit Men at the drop of a hat In My expirience and obsevations.
For example; If a Man simply says something, a joke perhaps, that the Woman doesn't like, 'SMACK!!!' I can't count the number of times I've witnessed this scenerio.
I have seen women (publicly) slap Men in the arm, the face, chest and groin, many times.
The thing is THIS often is not considered "abuse" or even violence.
BUT just reverse the genders and MAGICALY it then becomes, with out question, both violence AND abuse, whether done in "play" or not.
This is because, More and more society sees violence against males as "normal" and "exeptable." One need only to look toward "popular culture" IE, TV, Movies, ETC.
There is no END to the images of female violence against males.
I also believe that (many) women are SEXUALlY aroused by the sight of Men being beaten, tied up, humiliated, ETC.
If what I say seems "outrageous", I can EASILY back up my claim by simply pointing out the following;
In nearly EVERY advertisment directed at women the above scenerios are redundantly present. The same goes for movies and TV shows geared toward women.
However, for the most part, the same cannot be said for advertisments, TV shows and movies geared toward Men.
So while I really don't know who initiates violence more, Men or Women...
When the solid statistics come out on the subject, I will not be at all suprised if it IS, indeed women, after all.
May the flameing of Thundercloud begin.
Thundercloud.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Thomas: "I'd also like to see a study of violence in gay male relationships. It would be interesting if the statistically least violent relationships were those that had no women in them. That could well be the case, since in heterosexual relationships, it's usually the woman who initiates the violence."
There is an interesting summary of studies on homosexual relationships at http://www.dvmen.org/dv-31.htm#marker-1001840
in which it is noted:
"Bologna et al. (1987) surveyed 70 homosexual male and female college students about incidence of violence in the most recent relationship. Lesbian relationships were significantly more violent than gay relationships (56% vs. 25%)."
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
You wrote:
"In heterosexual relationships, it's usually the woman who initiates the violence."
My reply:
Men are not these out of control or abusive beasts that the rad fems would like to paint us as, therefore a key operative word that never gets mentioned, "ESCALATE," the action where, in 99% of the alleged d.v. circumstances, it is the woman who initiates, provokes, enflames, and escalates an otherwise peaceful and logical discussion into an emtotional and physical free for all. She promotes, and prosecutes the circumstances to the point that a man flees or defensively puts up his hands to block her insane, savage, battery, and then gets arrested for the usual fabricated and fraudulent reasons. DOMESTIC VIOLENCE LAW IS HATE CRIME against men (THIS LAW IS CRIME).
As long as there is one politician in office, that supports the present form of the Violence against Women Act, there will be a Nazi in office in America.
Ray
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Bologna et al. (1987) surveyed 70 homosexual male and female college students about incidence of violence in the most recent relationship. Lesbian relationships were significantly more violent than gay relationships (56% vs. 25%)
Thanks for that information and link WasatchFrontMan. We can also note "Lie, Schilit, Bush, Montague and Reyes (1991) reported, in a survey of 350 lesbians, that rates of verbal, physical and sexual abuse were all significantly higher in lesbian relationships than in heterosexual relationships: 56.8% had been sexually victimized by a female, 45% had experienced physical aggression, and 64.5% experienced physical or emotional aggression. Of this sample of women, 78.2% had been in a prior relationship with a man. Reports of violence by men were all lower than reports of violence in prior relationships with women (sexual victimization, 41.9% (vs. 56.8% with women); physical victimization 32.4% (vs. 45%) and emotional victimization 55.1% (vs. 64.5%)."
In other words, what these researchers found is that the most violent relationships are those with only women (56.8% were sexually victimized by a female!), the second most violent are those with a woman and a man, and the least violent are those with two men. We should all keep that info handy.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Thanks, there is strength in these kind of numbers too.
Ray
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
by Anonymous User on Wednesday August 21, @03:09AM EST (#49)
|
|
|
|
|
Thomas,
I was going to try and track down that info, Myself. but you just saved me the trouble.
THANK YOU!
And, yeah, Let's DO keep that information handy!!!
Thundercloud.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
by Anonymous User on Sunday August 18, @10:44PM EST (#32)
|
|
|
|
|
..and Erin Pizzey's wouldn't be making her rubbish claims because she's very anti-divorce would she?
Strange how thousands of people (both male and female)who've worked in battered womens' shelters in the UK, US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand etc, don't share her view.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
http://forever.freeshell.org/fv/lesbdv.htm
Here is a site I think it was Thomas that was interested in it.
http://www.fathersforlife.org/fv/Dan_Lynch_on_EP.h tm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
"Strange how thousands of people (both male and female)who've worked in battered womens' shelters in the UK, US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand etc, don't share her view."
Strange how even police arrest records don't share yours. But don't worry the fembots are working hard day and night to indoctrinate them even from what they see with their own eyes.
.
http://www.fathersforlife.org/fv/Dan_Lynch_on_EP.h tm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
by Anonymous User on Monday August 19, @02:25AM EST (#41)
|
|
|
|
|
LOVE your style Dan.
Don't ever change.
Thundercloud.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
...strange how all the billions have gone to battered women's shelters (women only) running the feminist agenda to get statistics to scam more men. This is an over obviously cooked up scam that refuses accountability to independent sources or public scrutiny. Get serious, if you want to believe that rad fem nonsense perhaps you would also be in the market to buy a bridge or two.
Ray
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know, Im often accused of being a woman hater simply because I state some of the things we are working on here. I tell them that women are doing as much violence and committing crime, as well that feminists have been lying about a number of things etc..etc... Yet they don't seem to see the reverse of man-hatred when they talk about the stats of what men are doing in related crimes.
.
http://www.fathersforlife.org/fv/Dan_Lynch_on_EP.h tm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
by Anonymous User on Monday August 19, @04:55PM EST (#44)
|
|
|
|
|
Dan.
Yeah, THAT'S because Millitant feminists and (Most) women KNOW that "woman hateing" is considered SACRELIGE, As women have been deified in modern western societies.
Ergo, calling someone a "woman hater" is EXACTLY like pointing at someone and shouting; "WITCH!!"In the days of the "Salem Witch trials."
It is an age old tactic used by any "group", organization or society that seeks to oppress, controll or destroy another "group" or "class".
The Millitant feminist element, as well as the average woman has this tactic down to a fine art.
They learned it from the "best". Which is why names like "Marx-fems" and "feminazis" are more than appropriate.
...I have enough aggrevation...
Thundercloud.
|
|
|
|
|
[an error occurred while processing this directive]
|
