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by Anonymous User on Tuesday January 08, @04:08PM EST (#1)
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i suppose that sex offenders are now terrorists as well.
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Men are what ever the Canadian Government, courts, children's aid scociety, FRO, declares them to be.
Not wanted and not trusted, anyway.
They should put a sign on the US/Canadian border that says,
Hand Guns
Men
Justice
Equal Rights
Freedom
Father's
not allowed across border
this list subject to change
without notice
WELCOME
(all terroists please have imigration documents and hotel reservation voucher available for inspection if asked)
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Given a choice between having his name and address on a website for all his neighbors to see, and therefore exposing him to a lynching, I suppose some men might actually prefer this option.
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Given a choice between having his name and address on a website for all his neighbors to see, and therefore exposing him to a lynching, I suppose some men might actually prefer this option.
Of course, this GPS idea would eventually extend to other crimes, so, conceivably, ANYONE could end up a part of this system. And how long would it be before the average joe hacker learns to get into the database and knows the individual's whereabouts 24 hours a day? And how long before those whereabouts are broadcast to the Internet or otherwise, resulting in an even more severe invasion of privacy?
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Well, to some degree this is already done in some places in the US. For example there are bracelets that are used to enforce house arrest for some offenders. In fact, some are even allowed to go to work. I agree, the GPS thing is another small encroachment on personal freedom, though. OBTW, someone is working on an injectible ID tag as one of the proposals for a national ID system in response to 9-11. It's not much of a stretch to add GPS capability to that and give one to everyone. The only thing holding back is miniaturization, and we've all seen what's been done in that area over the last thirty years.
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Well you know what will probably happen (this is Canada after all) the second or third time some commits a crime wearing one of these things, some sadist somewhere in the civil service will come up with the bright idea to include electro-shock ability into it. You know - heck why spend all that money on dispatching a police car to bing him back all the time, just zap him once or twice heck zap him whenever we feel like (yuk yuk)
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That won't stop the websites, it will just make it harder for the guy to get away from his attackers. They will just have to bring the scafold with them when they come.
It feels like a sleek new version of the old Town Square "Stocks" When they used to put somone into them with a yoke on their hands and neck.
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It's also a new twist on the scarlet letter, except it probably won't be as easy to hide and will assumably create even greater social repercussions then the scarlet letter would have. An ankle bracelet would make an ex-con's coworkers nervous keeping him in constant danger of being let go, permanently interfere with his dating/social life, cause complete strangers to be afraid of him, hate him, or both, etc.
Lady liberty is not blind and she first and foremost favors her own. After that justice is for sale. Considering these things I'd say the ankle bracelet is the most abyssmal idea I've heard so far this year.
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To me this goes back to the penal system. When is a person's payment for crime done. The purpose of punishment is to be punish and then done, your debt to society is repaid.
If they people are SO dangerous that we need to track their movements 24/7, then we should simply keep them in jail. Obviously their debt is not paid for, so why are they loose out in society?
So the simple answer for Canada is to LOCK UP every male baby in prison at birth. That way would could see what a wonderful Eden that the great white north would be when freed from the evil contraints of the male sex. I'm sure they would be a beacon of liberty and justice throughout the world!
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Now you can begin to see why the Quebecios want to separate from the rest of Canada ;-P
Joke
I think in time there will be a push for Canada to give up being so stupid and just join the United States - you need our natural resources and we need your constitution and currency - we can't manage it anymore. Affirmative action in this country has gone completey crazy infecting our supreme courts as well.
To really get ahead here, there is nothing quite so important as a woman's body.
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Canada must be invading the US. Affirmative action is quite crazy here as well, but maybe not to the degree up there.
In my city, we are currently under a racial desegragation order. The supposed goal is to provide blacks with an equal education with whites. Since enrollment numbers and forced bussing are the way to make the number "equal" that is what everything is focused on. The unfortunate fact is that all students in public schools are getting an equal education, equally as crappy. So those with means send their kids to private school and you have segragation the courts can do nothing about.
Yeah for affrimative action! And the legislature wonders why educated people are leaving the state in droves. God knows I'm trying. Maybe someplace like Wyoming or Montana would be nice.
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by Anonymous User on Tuesday January 08, @06:29PM EST (#14)
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Donald,
I'm sorry. Canada is what the US is becoming. I don't think we can save you, I really don't think we can save ourselves sometimes. "Citizen" is starting to equal "slave" here, and all in the name of "equality". I've been reading this kind of stuff alot the last ten years, and the internet has really helped me put things together and see how they are related. Not to mention I can keep track of ALL the laws that are passed, nd am in contact with tons of disparate civil-liberties groups and opinions.
My record in this society is spotless. I've managed to keep it that way because I was a shy Conservative Christian through most of my teens. I stayed away from the "wrong crowds". I never picked up bad habits. Of course, I didn't have much fun either. I never dated till I was in college , and to this day I've only had 3 girlfriends.
And so I stay out of danger by being a peripheral part of the larger society. Even so, I'm a criminal-who with incorrect speech has committed "hate crimes", with incorrect jokes and taps has committed "sexual harrassment", and I've fought physically with a few people over the years- thus committing assault. For you see, there are now so many laws that everyone is a criminal, to put it bluntly. Don't hold out your hopes for the USA alone Donald-- we all must work together if we are to have a ghost of a chance.
Remo
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"I'm sorry. Canada is what the US is becoming. I don't think we can save you, I really don't think we can save ourselves sometimes. "Citizen" is starting to equal "slave" here, and all in the name of "equality". I've been"
Ah well, this brings to mind some discussions I had about creation evolution with my Scientist brother (bear with me I have a point). He is the creationists ; God's truth, he is. His criticism centers around dating systems. The Archeologists reference the Anthropologists dating system who have just referenced the Archeologists dating system who have just referenced the Anthropologists etc. They are each using the other's data for validation.
Here is an example that is more closely related.
I asked for a report on child abuse statistics from Statistics Canada specifically who did what to whom I wanted to see who was doing the most abusing, and who were the greatest number of victims, because I had been told numbers on this site but wanted to see what our *.gov.ca had to say about it.
The sent me a *.pdf -Family Violence in Canada: A Statistical Profile 2001
Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics
Sounds great right? "Justice Statistics" I was starting to have a wonderful time drooling as I pulled tables out of pdf file and put them in my spread sheets.
That was just great until I discovered that the data has little or nothing to do with court proceedings.
It is not even double-blind clinical data nor is it peer-reviewed. It is a F*****g survey of Children's Aid Society case files !!!!
(BTW the Children's Aid Society [CAS] is the arm of the government that intervenes when children are allegedly at risk) I think you call them Children's Services in the USA.
My point being that this is not scientific data, so you can't build accurate models out of it. But they build models anyway.
Have you read Canada's Report to CEDAW at the UN? It is really quite frightening to see what they write. It is logical deduction and informed opinion that will determine the outcome of millions of lives.
Have you read your own countries report?
ours opens
COMMITTEE ON ELIMINATION OF DISCRIMINATION AGAINST WOMEN TAKES UP REPORTS BY CANADA
January 28 1997
Growth in Women's Employment, Violence against Women among Issues Discussed
The enhancement of women's economic autonomy and the elimination of systemic violence against women and children were two future priorities of the Canadian Government, according to Louise Bergeron-de Villiers, head of that country's delegation, as she presented this morning the third and fourth periodic reports on Canada's implementation of the Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women.
In introductory remarks to the Committee on the Elimination of Discrimination against Women, the Convention's monitoring body, the Coordinator of Status of Women of Canada, said the growth in women's employment had easily been one of the most significant changes in Canadian society over the last 20 years. However, economic restructuring and social change were creating opportunities for some women and hardships for others.
She went on to point out that, while women represented 45 per cent of all paid workers in 1994, the average earnings of women continued to be significantly lower. In 1995, women employed on a full-time basis earned an average of just 73 per cent of the average earnings of their male counterparts, and the majority of employed women remained concentrated in occupations which traditionally had been undervalued and lower paid.
One of the federal initiatives aimed at encouraging women's economic autonomy, she stated, was a package of amendments to the Employment Equity Act of 1996. The new legislation broadened the application of the Act to include federal public service, as well as federally regulated companies. This year, a child support legislation package would come into effect. A long-term initiative involved the measurement and valuing of unpaid work, which would be completed in 1998 and directed towards a framework for evaluating the policy implications of unpaid work. …"
This radical economic change it is a new world order. the retched thing in full.
The BASTARDS then respond to our report
NEED TO INCREASE NUMBER OF WOMEN IN CANADIAN JUDICIARY STRESSED BY EXPERTS AS CONSIDERATION OF COUNTRY'S REPORTS CONCLUDES
presented January 28 1997
[It opens]
"Women's Anti-Discrimination Committee Also Seeks Information About Disproportionate Impact on Women of Shrinking of Welfare System
Increasing the number of women in the Canadian judiciary and training magistrates in international law would make a significant difference in the advancement of women in Canada, experts on the Committee monitoring the Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women told that country's delegation this afternoon.
As the monitoring body concluded its consideration of the third and fourth periodic reports on Canada's implementation of the treaty, one expert noted judicial attitudes varied sharply between male and female judges, and, therefore, women judges would greatly affect jurisprudence particularly at the Supreme Court level. She cited a recent Supreme Court judgment disallowing child care expenses as a tax deduction, where the two female members of the bench had dissented. The Canadian Government needed to do more to improve women's access to the judiciary.
THIS frightful thing can be found here.
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Wait till they try to put women into one of these.
The Untited Nations (CEDOW) will be up in arms (so to speak). HEY!! You can't do that, it would be hard on the children to see their dear old mommy wearing one of those things.
You watch they'll use the kids to get out of it somehow.
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by Anonymous User on Tuesday January 08, @06:14PM EST (#12)
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As Claire Wolfe said:"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system but too early to shoot the bastards".
This is very much what I'm afraid of. Maybe it IS too late, and any "victories" we win will be short-lived and symbolic. I fear Constitutional is dead-has been dead for so long.
I still have hopes, and thats why I'm committed to working with the men's movement as much as possible. In the next year, I hope we can make progress on bringing due process and fairness back into family courts in terms of custody, visitation, and child support. And of course, choice for men.
As for how to do this, I'm going to apply a test to any proposed solutions that I, or someone else comes up with . The test will involve checking to see whether the proposed solution:
A. It increases governmental power
B. It treats one sex or another unfairly
C. Is humane
If it passes these three tests in my opinion, I'll support it, and work to help implement it.
Of course, the radfems aren't going to rest on their laurels. I suspect alot of what we do will be reactive rather than proactive. Lets try to slowly get the ball rolling our way.
Remo
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I have more to say but I am too tired right now.
My meds again.
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Yes, this is like the scarlet letter with more repercussions. How do you know if said offender will repeat his crimes? How do you know if s/he (let's suppose for a minute some women are found guilty) is really innocent of the crime and the court found him/her guilty because of false testimony or planted evidence?
I fear the trickle-down effect: that everyone will have to wear these bracelets, because most people are criminals, if they realize it or not. (Can you imagine the embarrassment of having cops come into your house in the middle of the night just becuase your SO was performing oral sex on you? And it'll be more embarassing b/c the Supreme Court won't uphold your rights!)
Big Sister may be watching, unfortunately...and I feel sorry for her victims. I wonder if in the future they'll lock men up and only let them out for breeding. *smart-ass*
"Female men's activist" is not an oxymoron.
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How do you know if said offender will repeat his crimes?
Psychopaths have a very high recidivism rate 90%? (until they reach middle age - why this happens at middle age is not known at this time).
Pedophiles recidivate at about 100 % and there is no known treatment, including, I beleive, castration [check facts here don].
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Then why are these people out of jail. Likely to make room for those REAL criminal predators. I mean its fine for a child molestor to be free, but we got that guy with 3 pot plants in for life!
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I think the forces at play here are those that started with absolute birth control. It is moral horror to abandon a new born in a massive garbage dump in the north end of a city like Bogota, Colombia when the child is number seven and 5 & 6 are slowly dying of poverty related disease and 3 & 4 left home permanently before the age of 8. It is again moral horror to kill someone very old with a pillow late at night to stifle the moans of terrible pain from a loved one who has only weeks left to live. It is moral horror to leave a comrade to die on the field of battle in a desperate skirmish during a war for freedom against Fascism.
People have been faced with moral horror by their own hands since the dawn of morality and conscience in our species.
What I believe has kept us from going insane has been the absolution incumbent in forces that are very clearly, in fact self evidently, beyond our control.
What made us believe as a society that there was no consequence to the purely arbitrary taking of life?
What made us believe, as a society, that abortion and birth control were decisions that should have been placed solely on the shoulders of any single woman?
What is the moral difference between aborting a fetus, and killing a new born?
The difference, what ever one believes it to be, is a fine distinction, one of purely academic construction enabled by technological/medical knowledge.
Maybe men let women down when they shuffled off the responsibility for abortion onto the shoulders of women, in the name of an ideology we call freedom; Which has evolved into something quite different than was originally constructed in the American constitution all those long years ago.
Maybe men should have done the terminating on behalf of the women, to save them from what must be the most spiritually lonely decision any human being can be asked to make.
Maybe men should be acting with the strength we have been proud of all these decades since women's suffrage began. Maybe we need to make the father of a conception destined for termination responsible for doing the termination - under strict medical supervision. Not as punishment, no, but as men together acting in concert with women, our loving partners, and helping all men to take equal responsibility for parenting including cessation of joint future parenting through terminating the unwanted conceptions they sire. So that women may indeed have the freedoms that we agree are the rights of all people. What freedom is there really when one is a life long prisoner in the solitary confinement of their own guilty conscience. If men contend that parenting is a responsibility that demands a father and mother, and more so that men are equally entitled under law too, then how can we then say that the new technological converse is any less true?
I think there is growing insanity in the land, and that it is a moral and spiritual pathology. Our skills and abilities have raced ahead of our philosophies, and we must look most closely within ourselves to find a way of tempering the ground to withstand what could become a plague.
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Actually, it's a pretty slick way of creating an underclass of clearly marked social "inferiors". Easily extended to other crimes, it can be argued that it's "for the good of society", and since about 94% of all people imprisoned are men..... Very neat.
When those so marked can't get other work because of their stigmata, will they be used as indentured workers in Feminist businesses, or will they be shuttled off to "rest camps" to serve the Greater Good?
Oh, and when no one employs them and they resort to crime to survive (thus "proving" that they are naturally criminal), maybe we will see a revival of that good old Feminist standard, eugenics to eradicate criminality and insanity from the race.
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Now I see what you are getting at.
As I think about it more,
The bracelet may not fall under the umbrella of traditional criminal law. It may be seen as relatively harmless to society at large, because it is not a restriction of freedom of movement, but a very minor invasion of privacy. So then its application becomes diverse.
Monitoring - Alleged or suspected terrorists, political opponents, your spouse or S.O., witnesses, journalists, and you wouldn't even know the damn thing was in your shoe, our lodged harmlessly in your digestive tract after eating that sandwich and the lunch counter.
The system will be technologically "leaky" just use an unpatched copy of MS Server II, so that interested parties can surreptitiously "tap in" and quickly locate a target.
Then there is piggy-backing on the leaky system where by "others" can craft homing devices that work opaquely within the structure.
AHHHH, this could explain a certain Software Giant's incredibly dare I say unbelievably leaky software, and its continued survival in spite of a monopolistic practices conviction.
Oh big brother is breathing down our necks so quickly.
It is getting truly ugly and so very fast.
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While there is obviously the possibility for great harm in the abuse of this sort of technology there are also potential benefits.
You are doubtless aware that prison is a miserable place for most men, particularly those not inclined to violence. Technologies like these could be used to enforce home detention as an alternative to prison for non-violent offenders (you know, embezzlers, forgers, burglars, dope dealers, wolf whistlers etc). The prisoner can even be allowed to attend his workplace and return.
This benefits both society (which is not deprived of the prisoner's labor or forced to keep him) and the prisoner.
Then there's the risk that this will be seen as such a clever and humane alternative to imprisonment that they start clapping bracelets on people for the least offence, even making up new offences to take advantage of this marvel of technology.
sd
Those who like this sort of thing
will find this the sort of thing they like.
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OOOOHHHHHHH
SHIT
It is breathtakingly simple and obvious. Canada puts the "system" in place; we get the infrastructure up and running who else is close enough to the USA to make it work reliably confidently expertly and make it discreetly accessible.
Then the USA has Canada monitor it's citizens for them courtesy of miniaturization and the Internet.
How do we get paid?
The money is laundered through the purchasing of natural resources and covered by NSA blanket, and Canadian Crown Corporations' budgeting practices.
That is why they are starting with sex offenders, because everyone will approve of it. It would make more sense to start with driving suspension violations now wouldn't it? The carnage caused by impaired drivers or bad or suspended drivers is so expensive that it would pay for itself in short order. But! It would attract "too" much media attention. EVERYONE LOATHES child molesters so it won't be monitored all that much but there just aren't that many of them so there will be plenty of room on the system.
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