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Debtor's Prison Is Alive And Well For Non-Custodial Fathers
posted by Nightmist on Wednesday December 26, @11:14AM
from the news dept.
News This horrifying article from the Fatherhood Coalition's Web site details Massachusettes efforts to put non-custodial parents (namely fathers) in prison for not paying up to 40 percent of their wages to the custodial parent. The story goes on to describe some of the civil rights violations of due process forced upon non-custodial fathers. For robbery, aggravated assault, homicide -- and perhaps even flying airplanes into buildings -- defendants are assumed innocent until proven guilty, provided legal counsel at taxpayer expense, and given every consideration to guarantee that their civil rights aren’t violated in the process of ascertaining their guilt. Non-custodial fathers should be so lucky.

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Why I visit this site (Score:1)
by Mars on Wednesday December 26, @12:57PM EST (#1)
(User #73 Info)
One of the principal attractions this site has for me is its stream of horror stories of the unaccountable miscarriges of justice perpetrated by the family courts. Surely the family courts are a portal to the underworld, where men are condemned to abysmal enslavement in the inner circles of hell for either impregnating or possibly marrying the wrong woman.

I've mentioned the next story before, but I never tire of repeating it ;): I once told bureaucrat who worked for the family court that I wouldn't father children on account of the punitive child support awards the family court determines, often on the basis of what a father could earn, and not what he does earn. Her reply completely sidesteped the question of just determinations of child support awards: "You have reason to believe you won't meet your obligations?" "What obligations?" I asked. She wanted me to go to debtor's prison--I could feel it (and therefore it's true, according to radical feminist epistemology). I have a fantasy of writing a letter to the local child support enforcement agency, even though I have no children of my own to support.


To whom it may concern,
You'll never get a dime from me in child support.
Cordially,
Mars


I imagine they'd invent a bill for me to pay. I could be in serious trouble.

I read these horror stories whenever I think about getting married or fathering children, and I am quickly disabused of the idea, although in my case it's just as well--I have more time to do mathematical research.

On the other hand, if I were in debtors prison for child support arrears, provided I'd get a pencil and access to my papers and books, I might be able to get more work done in jail than if I were slaving away for a family I couldn't see.
Re:Why I visit this site (Score:1)
by Adam H (adam@mensactivism.org) on Wednesday December 26, @01:49PM EST (#2)
(User #362 Info)
This article made Massachusetts News frontpage as well and Lewrockwell so it got more exposure than normal.
"Civil rights" (Score:1)
by Philalethes on Wednesday December 26, @02:27PM EST (#3)
(User #186 Info)
Well, nothing in this story is the least bit surprising to me. Nor, I must say, do I find it "horrifying" in itself, as it's only a tiny part of a much bigger picture I see every day all around. It's long been clear that the People's Republic of Massachusetts is well in the forefront of the Great Program to induct us all into the socialist/feminist New World Order, wherein we shall all be happy slaves/serfs for our benevolent owners/masters.

If you're concerned about such events, there are some things you should know about:

1) You should be aware that "civil rights" or "civil liberties" are not the same as the "unalienable rights" referenced in the Declaration of Independence, and guaranteed in the first ten amendments (all of them) to the United States Constitution. The difference is fundamental, and crucial: Jefferson's "unalienable rights" are "endowed by [our] creator," and cannot be taken from us by the government or anyone else (though we may voluntarily waive their exercise; see below). "Civil rights" are granted by the government, and thus the government may take them away whenever it feels the urge to do so.

2) You should be aware that if you are a "United States Citizen," by virtue of having applied for a social security number, a driver's license, a business license, incorporation, or any of a thousand other forms of "permission" from the government to exist and carry on your personal affairs, or if you have "registered" to "vote," or even if you have a state-issued birth certificate, you have voluntarily waived the exercise of and protection afforded by your "unalienable rights," both those specifically guaranteed by the Constitution and those "unenumerated" rights such as the right of "presumption of innocence" that are included in the Anglo-American Common Law tradition.

3) You should be aware that the "courts" wherein these events are taking place do not derive their authority from Article III of the Constitution, that is they are not Judicial Power courts, but merely administrative tribunals, agents of the executive branch whose purpose is not to seek the truth and arrive at justice, but to perfect and exert control over the lives of citizens, and extract revenue to be used for the government's purposes -- such as buying the votes of "single mothers," which class the government naturally has every interest in enlarging. This is true of nearly all "courts" operating in the United States today, especially the proliferating breed of administrative "courts" nowhere authorized in any Constitution, such as the "traffic," "family," etc. "courts." In fact, the comparison with "military tribunals," briefly mentioned in the article, is quite apt, for these "courts" are exactly the same kind of animal, in both law and function.

4) You should be aware that if/when you enter any of these "courts" as a "defendant," the "judge" therein is fully aware of all these facts, and "presumes" that you are aware of them also (which is, after all, your responsibility as a Citizen), and thus that you have indeed waived all your rights and placed yourself at the mercy of the "court," i.e. the revenue-collection official called a "judge" who is the absolute master in that environment (in a true judicial court, the judge is at most only a referee). Legally speaking, the "judge" could tell you to shoot yourself, and you would be obliged to do so. A slave must do his master's bidding.

This is only the beginning; for the moment we won't mention the fact that if you have an "attorney" to represent you (either hired by you or court-appointed) you should be aware that that individual is an officer of the court, whose first allegiance and duty is to the entity she serves, not to you (and whose boss is the "judge"). Are you getting the picture?

As I recall, every time I've seen a story like this on Mensactivism, the "judge" in the case has turned out to be female. Is there a pattern here? Wasn't the "19th Amendment" a great step forward?

I realize that some of this may be a bit of a shock to some who read it. Sorry; as Morpheus said, "I didn't say it would be easy; I only said it would be the truth." Truly, we are in deep doo-doo. The first step toward getting out must be to face the real, whole truth about our situation.

The United States of America was originally designed to be a Republic (see U.S. Const. Art. IV, Sec. 4), wherein the Citizens hold supreme authority, and the government, whose powers and activities are strictly limited by the Constitution, exists to serve the people. Does that look like what we have now? If not, why not? We can still get it back, but the hour is late.

The next step will be to abolish the United States of America (the only nation on Earth founded on the principles enumerated above) and turn us all over to the tender mercies of the United Nations. I have to laugh when my naive, well-meaning "liberal" friends decry the United States' failure (so far) to bow to the "World Court." A defendant in that "court" has no rights whatsoever, except the "right" to beg for mercy. Better get some knee-pads, guys.
Re:"Civil rights" (Score:1)
by donaldcameron1 (aal@amateuratlarge.com) on Wednesday December 26, @06:51PM EST (#4)
(User #357 Info) http://www.amateuratlarge.com
I have grown up beleving that no country protects personal freedoms as does the USA.

Don't lose hope, it can get much worse than it is. You are not as far gone as it feels. You are just waking up to the fact that men need to respond and do so vigorously. LOL At least you know there is a problem. Look at me for example. I knew something is wrong but I had no knowlege of what exactly was wrong.

You know it occurs to me that we might do well to paint a clear picture of the whole problem. Like a flow chart of what is going on.
If any of the staff at this site wish, I have 15 magabites of disk space on amateuratlarge.com that I don't really have the desire or strength to work at for my own idle interests at this time.
It just sits there unused, and there is no charge for the space.

I would be willing to lend a hand through my site to augment the great work going on here.

Let me know if I can be of help in this aspect.
Draconian child support, not reproductive rights (Score:0)
by Anonymous User on Wednesday December 26, @11:36PM EST (#5)

I read the article and it seems to me that this case is about draconian child support, not reproductive rights.

There's a difference.

Unless I missed something, I didn't see any claim that the man's family planning was disrupted.

The main complaint is that child support is too high.


Re:Draconian child support, not reproductive right (Score:1)
by donaldcameron1 (aal@amateuratlarge.com) on Thursday December 27, @01:52AM EST (#6)
(User #357 Info) http://www.amateuratlarge.com
Can men reproduce?

I thought radical feminists could do it all by themselves.
Re:Draconian child support, not reproductive right (Score:1)
by Philalethes on Friday December 28, @09:34AM EST (#8)
(User #186 Info)
Can men reproduce? I thought radical feminists could do it all by themselves.

A couple years back, during the first excitement about cloning, I read that some lesbian group had protested proposals to make human cloning illegal, which they said, would violate their "reproductive rights."

At least they're honest about what they intend, unlike most of their "sisters." I don't think the termite colony model is a worthy aim for human evolution; but of course, that's only my opinion.
Re:Draconian child support, not reproductive right (Score:2)
by Nightmist (nightmist@mensactivism.org) on Friday December 28, @11:28AM EST (#9)
(User #187 Info) http://www.jameshanbackjr.com
At least they're honest about what they intend, unlike most of their "sisters." I don't think the termite colony model is a worthy aim for human evolution; but of course, that's only my opinion.

The benefit of cloning is in medical reproduction, not the entire reproduction of a lifeform. Those who use it to create children are doing a disservice to evolution.

Re:Draconian child support, not reproductive right (Score:1)
by Mars on Friday December 28, @08:34PM EST (#10)
(User #73 Info)
Of course the lesbians would want to sue the donor--involuntary or not--of the cloned DNA for child support should they ever split up. We really shouldn't feel that men will become obsolete: who else is going to get stuck with child support?

Without men around, no child support would ever be paid, because the enforcement would automatically violate a woman's reproductive rights, which include forcing men, but not women, into parenthood, among other rights without corresponding responsibilities. You can't eliminate men without changing the landscape of reproductive rights for women, which put them in charge of reproduction without being responsible for it.
Re:Draconian child support, not reproductive right (Score:2)
by Nightmist (nightmist@mensactivism.org) on Friday December 28, @10:38PM EST (#11)
(User #187 Info) http://www.jameshanbackjr.com
Gee, Mars, you really know how to make a guy feel wanted. :)

Re:Draconian child support, not reproductive right (Score:1)
by Mars on Saturday December 29, @04:13PM EST (#12)
(User #73 Info)
I have a strong feeling that war wouldn't go away if there were no men. Consider Margaret Thatcher sending war ships armed with nuclear weapons to the Faulkand islands to fight against 13 year old boy soldiers.

We shouldn't forget the example of Margaret Thatcher--the shape of things to come.
America's Debtor Prisons (Score:1)
by Luek on Thursday December 27, @03:20AM EST (#7)
(User #358 Info)
It is a paradox that in a country that is so concerned about abuse of civil rights in other countries has this outmoded and cruel 18th century concept of debt collection still in use.

So much for the land of the free!

Phooey!!
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